Why update to SP3?

I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white paper 
which what's contained in SP3:

http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer

I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or two ago. 
It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white paper which 
applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not wireless, never will 
be. As close as I get to "networked" (other than the internetZ) is using 
some VPN software once a month to connect with my employer's system. If a 
service pack messed with that situation, I'd have to travel to Redmond with 
a rifle.

Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to mention? 
Something you think NO user should be without?

How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to describe? 
Remember, please, that you are under oath. 


0
JoeSpareBedroom
1/3/2010 6:25:24 PM
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"JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> wrote in message 
news:li50n.1663$nR4.1359@newsfe01.iad...
> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white paper 
> which what's contained in SP3:
>
> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer
>
> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or two 
> ago. It's running beautifully.

And lots of people have SP3 systems that work very well.

> I don't see anything in the white paper which applies to my computing 
> situation. Desktop machine, not wireless, never will be. As close as I get 
> to "networked" (other than the internetZ) is using some VPN software once 
> a month to connect with my employer's system. If a service pack messed 
> with that situation, I'd have to travel to Redmond with a rifle.

No, you'd simply restore from the backup you made.    You shouldn't install 
any major OS update without doing so.

>
> Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to mention? 
> Something you think NO user should be without?

How about the ability to get subsequent updates?

> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to describe? 
> Remember, please, that you are under oath.

SP3 is basically a rollup of SP2 patches with a few extra things.

However, without it, support for your pre-SP3 install will end before too 
long. 


0
Patrick
1/3/2010 6:32:02 PM

"JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> wrote in message 
news:li50n.1663$nR4.1359@newsfe01.iad...
> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white paper 
> which what's contained in SP3:
>
> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer
>
> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or two 
> ago. It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white paper 
> which applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not wireless, 
> never will be. As close as I get to "networked" (other than the internetZ) 
> is using some VPN software once a month to connect with my employer's 
> system. If a service pack messed with that situation, I'd have to travel 
> to Redmond with a rifle.
>
> Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to mention? 
> Something you think NO user should be without?
>
> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to describe? 
> Remember, please, that you are under oath.
>

Without SP3, you won't get any automatic security updates. On all the 
machines I updated to SP3 (friends, family, mine, and work), only one of the 
~30 gave me a problem, and that was an HP with an AMD processor. After 
applying the patch from HP, even it updated with no further problems.
-- 
SC Tom
 

0
SC
1/3/2010 6:36:12 PM
"JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> wrote in message 
news:li50n.1663$nR4.1359@newsfe01.iad...
> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white paper 
> which what's contained in SP3:
>
> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer
>
> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or two 
> ago. It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white paper 
> which applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not wireless, 
> never will be. As close as I get to "networked" (other than the 
> internetZ) is using some VPN software once a month to connect with my 
> employer's system. If a service pack messed with that situation, I'd 
> have to travel to Redmond with a rifle.
>
> Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to mention? 
> Something you think NO user should be without?
>
> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to 
> describe? Remember, please, that you are under oath.


I am not going to say that no one has ever has issues with SP3, but they 
are by far the minority, and nothing in particular is /broken/ with SP3.

FWIW, updates for SP/SP2 will end this July. Updates for XP/SP3 will 
continue until at least April, 2014.

My personal opinion: Install it.


If SP3 was downloaded with an anti-virus, or anti-spyware, program 
running, you may have a bad installation.

Steps to take before you install Windows XP Service Pack 3:
http://support.microsoft.com:80/kb/950717

WinXP SP3 - Read all prerequisites for a successful installation
http://msmvps.com/blogs/harrywaldron/archive/2008/05/08/windows-xp-sp3-read-all-prerequisites-for-a-successful-installation.aspx

Release Notes for Windows XP Service Pack 3
http://download.microsoft.com/download/c/d/8/cd8cc719-7d5a-40d3-a802-e4057aa8c631/relnotes.htm

Download Windows XP Service Pack 3 here:
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=5B33B5A8-5E76-401F-BE08-1E1555D4F3D4&displaylang=en

Free unlimited installation and compatibility support for Service Pack 3:
http://support.microsoft.com/oas/default.aspx?ln=en-us&prid=11273&gpr
-- 
           Bruce Hagen
         MS-MVP [Mail]
      Imperial Beach, CA

0
Bruce
1/3/2010 6:36:16 PM
"SC Tom" <sc@tom.net> wrote in message 
news:%23AuuhOKjKHA.5020@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
>
>
> "JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> wrote in message 
> news:li50n.1663$nR4.1359@newsfe01.iad...
>> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white paper 
>> which what's contained in SP3:
>>
>> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer
>>
>> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or two 
>> ago. It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white paper 
>> which applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not wireless, 
>> never will be. As close as I get to "networked" (other than the 
>> internetZ) is using some VPN software once a month to connect with my 
>> employer's system. If a service pack messed with that situation, I'd have 
>> to travel to Redmond with a rifle.
>>
>> Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to mention? 
>> Something you think NO user should be without?
>>
>> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to describe? 
>> Remember, please, that you are under oath.
>>
>
> Without SP3, you won't get any automatic security updates. On all the 
> machines I updated to SP3 (friends, family, mine, and work), only one of 
> the ~30 gave me a problem, and that was an HP with an AMD processor. After 
> applying the patch from HP, even it updated with no further problems.
> -- 
> SC Tom
>
>

On a 1 to 10 scale, with 10 meaning "Drive to Redmond with a rifle", how 
crippled was the HP machine? 


0
JoeSpareBedroom
1/3/2010 6:49:48 PM
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white
> paper which what's contained in SP3:
>
> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer
>
> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or
> two ago. It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white
> paper which applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not
> wireless, never will be. As close as I get to "networked" (other than
> the internetZ) is using some VPN software once a month to connect
> with my employer's system. If a service pack messed with that
> situation, I'd have to travel to Redmond with a rifle.
>
> Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to mention?
> Something you think NO user should be without?
>
> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to
> describe? Remember, please, that you are under oath.

There is a better way to reach your decision.

If you want to ensure that your system is secure and if you plan on 
using it beyond April, you should upgrade to SP3. SP2 security patches 
will stop being issued this coming April. SP3 will be supported through 
2014.

There is a tried and true method to upgrade to SP3 without any 
consequences, which has been discussed in this newsgroup many times. 
Should you decide to do so, if you are unable to locate the threads that 
outline the "best practices" method, start a new thread and we will be 
happy to guide you.

Finally, if you want to calm yourself down and make it less likely you 
would someday travel long distances with anger and a rifle, you need to 
get into the habit of regulalry imaging your hard drive. Before any 
major upgrade (including SP3), you would of course make sure you have a 
recent image which can be restored just in case. This backup plan would 
also save your butt in the event of *any* problem (malware, corrupted 
hard drive, etc.). 


0
Daave
1/3/2010 7:12:04 PM
"Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message 
news:OKDWoiKjKHA.5604@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white
>> paper which what's contained in SP3:
>>
>> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer
>>
>> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or
>> two ago. It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white
>> paper which applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not
>> wireless, never will be. As close as I get to "networked" (other than
>> the internetZ) is using some VPN software once a month to connect
>> with my employer's system. If a service pack messed with that
>> situation, I'd have to travel to Redmond with a rifle.
>>
>> Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to mention?
>> Something you think NO user should be without?
>>
>> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to
>> describe? Remember, please, that you are under oath.
>
> There is a better way to reach your decision.
>
> If you want to ensure that your system is secure and if you plan on using 
> it beyond April, you should upgrade to SP3. SP2 security patches will stop 
> being issued this coming April. SP3 will be supported through 2014.
>
> There is a tried and true method to upgrade to SP3 without any 
> consequences, which has been discussed in this newsgroup many times. 
> Should you decide to do so, if you are unable to locate the threads that 
> outline the "best practices" method, start a new thread and we will be 
> happy to guide you.
>
> Finally, if you want to calm yourself down and make it less likely you 
> would someday travel long distances with anger and a rifle, you need to 
> get into the habit of regulalry imaging your hard drive. Before any major 
> upgrade (including SP3), you would of course make sure you have a recent 
> image which can be restored just in case. This backup plan would also save 
> your butt in the event of *any* problem (malware, corrupted hard drive, 
> etc.).


Got an imaging program you like?

I'm only asking these questions because as we all know, there have been 
various horror shows connected with minor and major Windows updates. Some of 
them have not been acknowledged by Microsoft for a period of time known as 
"not acceptable", a measurement whose validity is defined ONLY by the user. 


0
JoeSpareBedroom
1/3/2010 7:18:56 PM
well, I would leave well enough
alone especially if you are feeling
very happy with the system and
your setup.

upgrading to the newer o.s., i.e.
vista or win7 would be the
advantageous thing.

however in doing so it would likely
require an upgrade in hardware
as well and this is an added cost
but a vast improvement over xp.

-------------

if you choose to install the sp3
update and update your current
o.s.

sp3 can be uninstalled via a/r
programs.

in doing so, the system will
revert back to sp2.

incidentally, one thing to keep in mind
if you choose to update the system

is to do a clean boot and ensure
that nothing is loaded up with
windows.

antivirals have a tendency to
impede the installation.

-- 
db���`�...�><)))�>
DatabaseBen, Retired Professional
 - Systems Analyst
 - Database Developer
 - Accountancy
 - Veteran of the Armed Forces
-  @Hotmail.com
-  nntp Postologist
~ "share the nirvana" - dbZen

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>

"JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> wrote in message 
news:li50n.1663$nR4.1359@newsfe01.iad...
> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white paper 
> which what's contained in SP3:
>
> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer
>
> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or two 
> ago. It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white paper 
> which applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not wireless, 
> never will be. As close as I get to "networked" (other than the internetZ) 
> is using some VPN software once a month to connect with my employer's 
> system. If a service pack messed with that situation, I'd have to travel 
> to Redmond with a rifle.
>
> Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to mention? 
> Something you think NO user should be without?
>
> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to describe? 
> Remember, please, that you are under oath.
> 
0
db
1/3/2010 7:33:42 PM
"db" <databaseben@hotmail.com> wrote in message 
news:OjMTtuKjKHA.1824@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
> well, I would leave well enough
> alone especially if you are feeling
> very happy with the system and
> your setup.
>
> upgrading to the newer o.s., i.e.
> vista or win7 would be the
> advantageous thing.


OK - I'll bite. Why would it be to my advantage to switch* to Vista or Win7?

* "upgrade" not proven yet in this discussion. 


0
JoeSpareBedroom
1/3/2010 7:52:44 PM
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
> news:OKDWoiKjKHA.5604@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white
>>> paper which what's contained in SP3:
>>>
>>> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer
>>>
>>> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or
>>> two ago. It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white
>>> paper which applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not
>>> wireless, never will be. As close as I get to "networked" (other than
>>> the internetZ) is using some VPN software once a month to connect
>>> with my employer's system. If a service pack messed with that
>>> situation, I'd have to travel to Redmond with a rifle.
>>>
>>> Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to mention?
>>> Something you think NO user should be without?
>>>
>>> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to
>>> describe? Remember, please, that you are under oath.
>>
>> There is a better way to reach your decision.
>>
>> If you want to ensure that your system is secure and if you plan on using
>> it beyond April, you should upgrade to SP3. SP2 security patches will 
>> stop
>> being issued this coming April. SP3 will be supported through 2014.
>>
>> There is a tried and true method to upgrade to SP3 without any
>> consequences, which has been discussed in this newsgroup many times.
>> Should you decide to do so, if you are unable to locate the threads that
>> outline the "best practices" method, start a new thread and we will be
>> happy to guide you.
>>
>> Finally, if you want to calm yourself down and make it less likely you
>> would someday travel long distances with anger and a rifle, you need to
>> get into the habit of regulalry imaging your hard drive. Before any major
>> upgrade (including SP3), you would of course make sure you have a recent
>> image which can be restored just in case. This backup plan would also 
>> save
>> your butt in the event of *any* problem (malware, corrupted hard drive,
>> etc.).
>
>
> Got an imaging program you like?

Many of us here have been quite happy with Acronis True Image.   That's 
probably the most popular imaging program. 


0
Bill
1/3/2010 7:54:06 PM
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> "db" <databaseben@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:OjMTtuKjKHA.1824@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>> well, I would leave well enough
>> alone especially if you are feeling
>> very happy with the system and
>> your setup.
>>
>> upgrading to the newer o.s., i.e.
>> vista or win7 would be the
>> advantageous thing.
>
>
> OK - I'll bite. Why would it be to my advantage to switch* to Vista or 
> Win7?

It wouldn't, if you're happy with what you have (XP, as many of us are). 
:-) 


0
Bill
1/3/2010 7:59:40 PM
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
> news:OKDWoiKjKHA.5604@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white
>>> paper which what's contained in SP3:
>>>
>>> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer
>>>
>>> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or
>>> two ago. It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white
>>> paper which applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not
>>> wireless, never will be. As close as I get to "networked" (other
>>> than the internetZ) is using some VPN software once a month to
>>> connect with my employer's system. If a service pack messed with
>>> that situation, I'd have to travel to Redmond with a rifle.
>>>
>>> Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to
>>> mention? Something you think NO user should be without?
>>>
>>> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to
>>> describe? Remember, please, that you are under oath.
>>
>> There is a better way to reach your decision.
>>
>> If you want to ensure that your system is secure and if you plan on
>> using it beyond April, you should upgrade to SP3. SP2 security
>> patches will stop being issued this coming April. SP3 will be
>> supported through 2014. There is a tried and true method to upgrade 
>> to SP3 without any
>> consequences, which has been discussed in this newsgroup many times.
>> Should you decide to do so, if you are unable to locate the threads
>> that outline the "best practices" method, start a new thread and we
>> will be happy to guide you.
>>
>> Finally, if you want to calm yourself down and make it less likely
>> you would someday travel long distances with anger and a rifle, you
>> need to get into the habit of regulalry imaging your hard drive.
>> Before any major upgrade (including SP3), you would of course make
>> sure you have a recent image which can be restored just in case.
>> This backup plan would also save your butt in the event of *any*
>> problem (malware, corrupted hard drive, etc.).
>
>
> Got an imaging program you like?
>
> I'm only asking these questions because as we all know, there have
> been various horror shows connected with minor and major Windows
> updates. Some of them have not been acknowledged by Microsoft for a
> period of time known as "not acceptable", a measurement whose
> validity is defined ONLY by the user.

I will definitely agree with you that many people have experienced 
issues with Microsoft updates. However, if a person sticks *only* to 
critical security updates (which is what I always recommend -- and 
DEFINITELY avoid drivers, too!), the chances of a bad update are quite 
low. Also, more often than not, simply uninstalling the update fixes the 
issue.

That being said, in those rare instances where a Windows update does 
break a system, an image that can be restored can be a godsend!

I like Acronis True Image Home. Its major advantage is you can make 
quick incremental images after you have made the initial full image. But 
it's not free.

If you are looking for a good free imaging program, I have had success 
with DriveImageXML. Its downside is that you can't make incremental 
images. Also, you would need to create an emergency bootable CD (like 
UBCD4Win) in order to restore the image. But by golly, it does work!

An alternative to imaging is cloning, where you wind up with an 
identical cloned hard drive, which of course would be bootable since it 
is identical. Some people prefer this method to imaging. Although 
Acronis True Image Home also offers a cloning option, you cannot create 
incremental clones with it. For that feature, you would need to use 
Casper.

There are many options. Different people favor different solutions. I 
like Acronis True Image Home, personally. 


0
Daave
1/3/2010 8:02:19 PM
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white
> paper which what's contained in SP3:
>
> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110
>
> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or
> two ago. It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the
> white paper which applies to my computing situation. Desktop
> machine, not wireless, never will be. As close as I get to
> "networked" (other than the internetZ) is using some VPN software
> once a month to connect with my employer's system. If a service
> pack messed with that situation, I'd have to travel to Redmond with
> a rifle.
> Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to
> mention? Something you think NO user should be without?
>
> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to
> describe? Remember, please, that you are under oath.

It's a personal decision - like everything else.  No one here really cares 
in the end.  It's your machine, if you get infested/infected or have other 
issues, you'll come back and likely ask questions and likely be chastized 
for not having SP3 if you still have not installed it - as it is *not new* - 
and truthfully - only causes issues *if* your computer already had issues 
for it to expose in my experience.

As with everything - you should have current backups or even a current 
drive/partition image (many applications out there; some free, some not.) 
Not having backups is just unwise - after all - if you could backup your own 
life and go back to some point in time when something went wrong - I would 
bet you would do it.

In the end - it is up to you.  People still run Windows 98 as of today.

Soon enough you will be unable to get any updates for your Windows
XP system unless you have Windows XP SP3.  If you have Windows XP
SP3 - you should be able to receive updates from Microsoft until April 2014.

List of fixes that are included in Windows XP Service Pack 3
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/946480/

The article clearly states that the list of fixes it shows were added to SP3
only.  If you want to know what was included in SP2 or SP1a - they have
links in the article.  ("The following fix list includes only the updates
that were added in Windows XP SP3.")

So - out of those 1174 additional fixes (yes - there are 1174 listed in SP3
alone) - how many do you have installed Post-SP2?  I had about 100-120 on
a good day before SP3 was released. ;-)

While right now you can still download the patches from Microsoft if you
have not upgraded to SP3 - that will soon end.  Combine that with the
hardware and software manufacturers who have already started cutting
their product support off at Windows XP SP3 or later operating systems and
you are building yourself a nice wall preventing yourself from using new
hardware and new software in a very short period of time (some cannot get
over your wall now.)  That is something you should weigh in on when making
your final decision.

You'll likely live a long and happy life without them.  Your computer
might stay running perfectly for many decades to come without SP3.  You may
never change OSes, you may never upgrade applications and you may be
perfectly safe behind a router with your same antivirus/antispyware running.

Make sure you keep really good backups - no matter what - but especially if
you decide you are okay with not fixing your machine (cleaning up whatever
obvious issue it has now) so SP3 can install properly.

If it was me or someone I knew and/or cared about - I would be going
through the instructions I gave in order to remedy an obvious problem
with the system as Windows XP SP3 should install on a fully
functional/clean Windows XP system - and if it doesn't - something is
wrong with said system.

Want to go through a nice procedure, clearly laid out, that should get 
Windows XP SP3 installed on your system and ensure it is in top-shape as 
well?  I've got one - given it many times - I'm going to post it here 
again...

Also know that it is not long because of SP3 - but because of how people 
unknowingly do not properly maintain their system.  Most of these steps - if 
not all - would be unnecessary on a well maintained and clean system. 
However - it is also very easy these days to click on the wrong thing, 
etc...  So this covers all the bases.

If you do this - know this - it doesn't matter if you do some of the steps I 
give everyday - you should do them *as given* without deviation, without 
skipping around, without ignoring one because you don't think it is 
necessary...  It will ensure you have everything in order and ready.

My instructions *will* take time for you to get through - but they will not
only likely get SP3 installed on your Windows XP system - but probably make
the system snappier than it has been in some time.

First - please verify the exact edition, version and architecture of
Windows XP you have:

Press and hold down the Windows key on your keyboard and then press the
"Pause/Break" key.  Let go of both.  This is equivalent in Windows XP to
having right-clicked on the "My Computer" icon and chosen "Properties"
from the menu that appears.  When the new window appears - ensure you are
under the "General" tab.  Is there *anything* in there to indicate you
have a 64-bit version of Windows XP, like the words, "Windows XP
Professional x64 Edition Version"?

If there is, let everyone here know this and stop the quest - as you have no
SP3 for your operating system.

If there is not, let everyone here know this and continue the quest.

Next we will get the edition and version information...

 Start button --> RUN
 (no "RUN"?  Press the "Windows Key" + R on your keyboard)
 --> type in:
   winver
 --> Click OK.

The picture at the top of the window that opens will give you the general
(Operating System name and edition) while the line starting with the word
"version" will give you the rest of the story.  Post _both_ in response
to this message verbatim.  No paraphrasing - instead - ensure
character-for-character copying.

What version of Internet Explorer are you currently using?  Easy to find
out.  Open Internet Explorer and while that is in-focus, press and hold
the "ALT" key on your keyboard.  With the "ALT" key still pressed, press
(just once, no holding) the "H" key.  Now, with the "ALT" key still
pressed,  press (just once, no holding) the "A" key.   That will bring up
the "About Internet Explorer" window.  It will give you the exact version
you are using - repeat what you see there in response to this message.

Next question has to do with what type of computer you own and what type
of processor it has.  It's pretty straight forward: Is it an HP branded
computer and does it have an AMD processor installed?

If the answer to BOTH of those is YES, then you need to prevent a known
issue with that combination using the following instructions:
http://h10025.www1.hp.com:80/ewfrf/wc/genericSoftwareDownloadIndex?lc=en&dlc=en&cc=us&softwareitem=pv-60484-2

If the answer to EITHER of those is NO, then you are generally safe in
continuing on.  But either way - answer back here so everyone can know
what you are doing/what you have step-by-excruciating-step.

Now that we have some base information, let's cleanup and get ready to
install Windows XP SP3 onto your Windows XP system.

Reboot so you start with a fresh machine.  For everything here you will
need to logon as an user with administrative (installation) priviledges.

Fix your file/registry permissions...

Ignore the title and follow the sub-section under
"Advanced Troubleshooting" titled,
"Method 1: Reset the registry and the file permissions"
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/949377
*will take time
** Ignore the last step (6) - you'll install SP3 shortly, but not now.

You will likely see errors pass by if you watching, even count up.  No
worries *at this time*.

*After* that is done, continue on to the next part where you clean off
some excess (unnecessary) files.  It only removes those you definitely
do not need, if you follow the directions *as given* and do not deviate.
So reboot (for each of these steps, it is just best to reboot right
before - but I will continue to point that out) and logon as an user with
administrative priviledges.

Download/install the "Windows Installer CleanUp Utility":
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/290301

After installing, do the following:

Start button --> RUN
 (no "RUN"?  Press the "Windows Key" + R on your keyboard)
 --> type in:
  "%ProgramFiles%\Windows Installer Clean Up\msizap.exe" g!
--> Click OK.
(The quotation marks and percentage signs and spacing should be exact.)

It will flash by *quick*, don't expect much out of this step to get
excited about.  But the cleaner your machine is to start with, the
better your luck will be later (not really luck - more like preparedness,
but that's not as fun to think about, eh?)

Yeah - you will get tired of rebooting - but let's soldier on and reboot
again and logon as an user with administrative priviledges.

This time (and this is one of the more time-consuming steps) you will be
running (one at a time with reboots in-between each) three different
anti-spyware/anti-malware applications to ensure you come up clean.

Download, install, run, update and perform a full scan with the following
(freeware version):

SuperAntiSpyware
http://www.superantispyware.com/

Reboot and logon as administrative user.

Download, install, run, update and perform a full scan with the following
(freeware version):

MalwareBytes
http://www.malwarebytes.com/

Reboot and logon as administrative user.

Download and run the MSRT manually:
http://www.microsoft.com/security/malwareremove/default.mspx

You may find nothing, you may find only cookies, you may think it is a
waste of time - but if you do all this and report back here with what you
do/don't find as you are doing all of it - you are adding more pieces to
the puzzle and the entire picture just may become clearer and your
problem resolved.

Reboot and logon as administrative user.

Download/Install the latest Windows Installer (for your OS):
( Windows XP 32-bit : WindowsXP-KB942288-v3-x86.exe )
http://www.microsoft.com/downloadS/details.aspx?familyid=5A58B56F-60B6-4412-95B9-54D056D6F9F4&displaylang=en

Reboot and logon as administrative user.

Download the latest version of the Windows Update agent from here (x86):
http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=91237
.... and save it to the root of your C:\ drive.  After saving it to the
root of the C:\ drive, do the following:

Close all Internet Explorer windows and other applications.

Start button --> RUN and type in:
   %SystemDrive%\windowsupdateagent30-x86.exe /WUFORCE
--> Click OK.

(If asked, select "Run.) --> Click on NEXT --> Select "I agree" and click on
NEXT --> When it finishes installing, click on "Finish"...

Reboot and logon as administrative user.

Visit this web page:

How do I reset Windows Update components?
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/971058

.... and click on the "Microsoft Fix it" icon.  When asked, select "RUN",
both times.  Check the "I agree" box and click on "Next".  Check the box
for "Run aggressive options (not recommended)" and click "Next".  Let
it finish up and follow the prompts until it is done.  Close/exit and
reboot when it is.

Now for SP3...

Download the full SP3 installation file.

Windows XP Service Pack 3 Network Installation Package for
IT Professionals and Developers (works just as well for you.)
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=5B33B5A8-5E76-401F-BE08-1E1555D4F3D4

You are just saving it right now - not running it yet.  There will be no
file size deviation - it is 316.4MB.

You should now perform a full CHKDSK on your system drive (C:)...

 How to scan your disks for errors
 http://support.microsoft.com/kb/315265
 * will take time and a reboot

You should now perform a full Defragment on your system drive (C:)...

 How to Defragment your hard drives
 http://support.microsoft.com/kb/314848
 * will take time

Reboot right before you try to install SP3.

Disconnect from the internet before installing (physically disconnect -
pull the network cable or disable the router/modem.)

Uninstall any and all third-party firewall applications (ZoneAlarm, etc)
and utilize the built-in Windows Firewall only.

Disable your antivirus and antispyware applications when you are about to
install SP3.  Usually right-click on the icon in the taskbar gives you
a choice to do so.

Install SP3 by running the downloaded executable.

Reboot when requested to do so.

Logon and let the machine 'settle' for about 10 minutes.

Reboot.

Give it 5 minutes after logon to 'settle' - reboot.

After that - there will be more updates.

Log on as an user with administrative rights and open Internet Explorer
and visit http://windowsupdate.microsoft.com/ and select to do a
CUSTOM scan...

Every time you are about to click on something while at these web pages -
first press and hold down the CTRL key while you click on it.  You can
release the CTRL key after clicking each time.

Once the scan is done, select just _ONE_ of the high priority updates
(deselect any others) and install it.

Reboot again.

If it did work - try the web page again - selecting no more than 3-5 at a
time.  Rebooting as needed.

The Optional Software updates are generally safe - although I recommend
against the "Windows Search" one and any of the "Office Live" ones or
"Windows Live" ones for now.  I would completely avoid the
Optional Hardware updates.  Also - I do not see any urgent need to
install Internet Explorer 8 at this time.

Seriously - do all that.  This is like antibiotics - don't skip a single
step, don't quit because you think things will be okay now - go through
until the end, until you have done everything given in the order given.  If
you have a problem with a step come ask and let someone here get you
through that step.  If you don't understand how to do a step, come back
and ask here about that step and let someone walk you through it.

Then - when done - let everyone here know if it worked for you - or if
you have more issues.

-- 
Shenan Stanley
     MS-MVP
-- 
How To Ask Questions The Smart Way
http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html 


0
Shenan
1/3/2010 8:07:42 PM
SP-3 is listed in the updates in Add/Remove programs, so it can be easily 
uninstalled.

****


"JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> wrote in message 
news:li50n.1663$nR4.1359@newsfe01.iad...
I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white paper
which what's contained in SP3:

http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer

I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or two ago.
It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white paper which
applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not wireless, never will
be. As close as I get to "networked" (other than the internetZ) is using
some VPN software once a month to connect with my employer's system. If a
service pack messed with that situation, I'd have to travel to Redmond with
a rifle.

Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to mention?
Something you think NO user should be without?

How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to describe?
Remember, please, that you are under oath.



0
Larry
1/3/2010 8:20:56 PM
"Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message 
news:%23AtEt%23KjKHA.4048@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
>> news:OKDWoiKjKHA.5604@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>>> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>>> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white
>>>> paper which what's contained in SP3:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer
>>>>
>>>> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or
>>>> two ago. It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white
>>>> paper which applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not
>>>> wireless, never will be. As close as I get to "networked" (other
>>>> than the internetZ) is using some VPN software once a month to
>>>> connect with my employer's system. If a service pack messed with
>>>> that situation, I'd have to travel to Redmond with a rifle.
>>>>
>>>> Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to
>>>> mention? Something you think NO user should be without?
>>>>
>>>> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to
>>>> describe? Remember, please, that you are under oath.
>>>
>>> There is a better way to reach your decision.
>>>
>>> If you want to ensure that your system is secure and if you plan on
>>> using it beyond April, you should upgrade to SP3. SP2 security
>>> patches will stop being issued this coming April. SP3 will be
>>> supported through 2014. There is a tried and true method to upgrade to 
>>> SP3 without any
>>> consequences, which has been discussed in this newsgroup many times.
>>> Should you decide to do so, if you are unable to locate the threads
>>> that outline the "best practices" method, start a new thread and we
>>> will be happy to guide you.
>>>
>>> Finally, if you want to calm yourself down and make it less likely
>>> you would someday travel long distances with anger and a rifle, you
>>> need to get into the habit of regulalry imaging your hard drive.
>>> Before any major upgrade (including SP3), you would of course make
>>> sure you have a recent image which can be restored just in case.
>>> This backup plan would also save your butt in the event of *any*
>>> problem (malware, corrupted hard drive, etc.).
>>
>>
>> Got an imaging program you like?
>>
>> I'm only asking these questions because as we all know, there have
>> been various horror shows connected with minor and major Windows
>> updates. Some of them have not been acknowledged by Microsoft for a
>> period of time known as "not acceptable", a measurement whose
>> validity is defined ONLY by the user.
>
> I will definitely agree with you that many people have experienced issues 
> with Microsoft updates. However, if a person sticks *only* to critical 
> security updates (which is what I always recommend -- and DEFINITELY avoid 
> drivers, too!), the chances of a bad update are quite low. Also, more 
> often than not, simply uninstalling the update fixes the issue.
>
> That being said, in those rare instances where a Windows update does break 
> a system, an image that can be restored can be a godsend!
>
> I like Acronis True Image Home. Its major advantage is you can make quick 
> incremental images after you have made the initial full image. But it's 
> not free.
>
> If you are looking for a good free imaging program, I have had success 
> with DriveImageXML. Its downside is that you can't make incremental 
> images. Also, you would need to create an emergency bootable CD (like 
> UBCD4Win) in order to restore the image. But by golly, it does work!
>
> An alternative to imaging is cloning, where you wind up with an identical 
> cloned hard drive, which of course would be bootable since it is 
> identical. Some people prefer this method to imaging. Although Acronis 
> True Image Home also offers a cloning option, you cannot create 
> incremental clones with it. For that feature, you would need to use 
> Casper.
>
> There are many options. Different people favor different solutions. I like 
> Acronis True Image Home, personally.
>


Aside from the disadvantage of the disk space it occupies, would setting a 
restore point before the update achieve the same thing? 


0
JoeSpareBedroom
1/3/2010 8:25:02 PM

"JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> wrote in message 
news:eF50n.1668$nR4.968@newsfe01.iad...
> "SC Tom" <sc@tom.net> wrote in message 
> news:%23AuuhOKjKHA.5020@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
>>
>>
>> "JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> wrote in message 
>> news:li50n.1663$nR4.1359@newsfe01.iad...
>>> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white paper 
>>> which what's contained in SP3:
>>>
>>> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer
>>>
>>> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or two 
>>> ago. It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white paper 
>>> which applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not wireless, 
>>> never will be. As close as I get to "networked" (other than the 
>>> internetZ) is using some VPN software once a month to connect with my 
>>> employer's system. If a service pack messed with that situation, I'd 
>>> have to travel to Redmond with a rifle.
>>>
>>> Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to mention? 
>>> Something you think NO user should be without?
>>>
>>> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to 
>>> describe? Remember, please, that you are under oath.
>>>
>>
>> Without SP3, you won't get any automatic security updates. On all the 
>> machines I updated to SP3 (friends, family, mine, and work), only one of 
>> the ~30 gave me a problem, and that was an HP with an AMD processor. 
>> After applying the patch from HP, even it updated with no further 
>> problems.
>> -- 
>> SC Tom
>>
>>
>
> On a 1 to 10 scale, with 10 meaning "Drive to Redmond with a rifle", how 
> crippled was the HP machine?
>

For the 2 or 3 hours it took to research, restore, download, and install the 
patch, it wouldn't boot at all except into safe mode, so I'd say 7 or 8. It 
was easy enough to fix, though, and like a dummy, I didn't research the AMD 
problem beforehand because I hadn't had any problems with other HP's with 
AMD's. So it was my fault that I had the problem due to my lack of 
preparation (and HP's for the image they used at that time).
-- 
SC Tom
 

0
SC
1/3/2010 8:25:37 PM

"Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message 
news:#AtEt#KjKHA.4048@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
>> news:OKDWoiKjKHA.5604@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>>> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>>> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white
>>>> paper which what's contained in SP3:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer
>>>>
>>>> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or
>>>> two ago. It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white
>>>> paper which applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not
>>>> wireless, never will be. As close as I get to "networked" (other
>>>> than the internetZ) is using some VPN software once a month to
>>>> connect with my employer's system. If a service pack messed with
>>>> that situation, I'd have to travel to Redmond with a rifle.
>>>>
>>>> Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to
>>>> mention? Something you think NO user should be without?
>>>>
>>>> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to
>>>> describe? Remember, please, that you are under oath.
>>>
>>> There is a better way to reach your decision.
>>>
>>> If you want to ensure that your system is secure and if you plan on
>>> using it beyond April, you should upgrade to SP3. SP2 security
>>> patches will stop being issued this coming April. SP3 will be
>>> supported through 2014. There is a tried and true method to upgrade to 
>>> SP3 without any
>>> consequences, which has been discussed in this newsgroup many times.
>>> Should you decide to do so, if you are unable to locate the threads
>>> that outline the "best practices" method, start a new thread and we
>>> will be happy to guide you.
>>>
>>> Finally, if you want to calm yourself down and make it less likely
>>> you would someday travel long distances with anger and a rifle, you
>>> need to get into the habit of regulalry imaging your hard drive.
>>> Before any major upgrade (including SP3), you would of course make
>>> sure you have a recent image which can be restored just in case.
>>> This backup plan would also save your butt in the event of *any*
>>> problem (malware, corrupted hard drive, etc.).
>>
>>
>> Got an imaging program you like?
>>
>> I'm only asking these questions because as we all know, there have
>> been various horror shows connected with minor and major Windows
>> updates. Some of them have not been acknowledged by Microsoft for a
>> period of time known as "not acceptable", a measurement whose
>> validity is defined ONLY by the user.
>
> I will definitely agree with you that many people have experienced issues 
> with Microsoft updates. However, if a person sticks *only* to critical 
> security updates (which is what I always recommend -- and DEFINITELY avoid 
> drivers, too!), the chances of a bad update are quite low. Also, more 
> often than not, simply uninstalling the update fixes the issue.
>
> That being said, in those rare instances where a Windows update does break 
> a system, an image that can be restored can be a godsend!
>
> I like Acronis True Image Home. Its major advantage is you can make quick 
> incremental images after you have made the initial full image. But it's 
> not free.
>
> If you are looking for a good free imaging program, I have had success 
> with DriveImageXML. Its downside is that you can't make incremental 
> images. Also, you would need to create an emergency bootable CD (like 
> UBCD4Win) in order to restore the image. But by golly, it does work!
>
> An alternative to imaging is cloning, where you wind up with an identical 
> cloned hard drive, which of course would be bootable since it is 
> identical. Some people prefer this method to imaging. Although Acronis 
> True Image Home also offers a cloning option, you cannot create 
> incremental clones with it. For that feature, you would need to use 
> Casper.
>
> There are many options. Different people favor different solutions. I like 
> Acronis True Image Home, personally.
>
If you own a Western Digital, Seagate, or Maxtor internal or external hard 
drive, you can get Acronis True Image for free. It's not the full-featured 
version, but works very well. Saved my butt a couple of times :-)
-- 
SC Tom
 

0
SC
1/3/2010 8:30:27 PM
"SC Tom" <sc@tom.net> wrote in message 
news:uJO%23qLLjKHA.5608@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
>
>
> "JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> wrote in message 
> news:eF50n.1668$nR4.968@newsfe01.iad...
>> "SC Tom" <sc@tom.net> wrote in message 
>> news:%23AuuhOKjKHA.5020@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
>>>
>>>
>>> "JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> wrote in message 
>>> news:li50n.1663$nR4.1359@newsfe01.iad...
>>>> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white 
>>>> paper which what's contained in SP3:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer
>>>>
>>>> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or two 
>>>> ago. It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white paper 
>>>> which applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not wireless, 
>>>> never will be. As close as I get to "networked" (other than the 
>>>> internetZ) is using some VPN software once a month to connect with my 
>>>> employer's system. If a service pack messed with that situation, I'd 
>>>> have to travel to Redmond with a rifle.
>>>>
>>>> Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to mention? 
>>>> Something you think NO user should be without?
>>>>
>>>> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to 
>>>> describe? Remember, please, that you are under oath.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Without SP3, you won't get any automatic security updates. On all the 
>>> machines I updated to SP3 (friends, family, mine, and work), only one of 
>>> the ~30 gave me a problem, and that was an HP with an AMD processor. 
>>> After applying the patch from HP, even it updated with no further 
>>> problems.
>>> -- 
>>> SC Tom
>>>
>>>
>>
>> On a 1 to 10 scale, with 10 meaning "Drive to Redmond with a rifle", how 
>> crippled was the HP machine?
>>
>
> For the 2 or 3 hours it took to research, restore, download, and install 
> the patch, it wouldn't boot at all except into safe mode, so I'd say 7 or 
> 8. It was easy enough to fix, though, and like a dummy, I didn't research 
> the AMD problem beforehand because I hadn't had any problems with other 
> HP's with AMD's. So it was my fault that I had the problem due to my lack 
> of preparation (and HP's for the image they used at that time).
> -- 
> SC Tom


One must wonder what happens to thousands of ***customers*** who have auto 
update turned on because they trust the process and don't think any pre-rape 
research is needed.  "My machine's a year old, but it's a mess so I'm buying 
a new one." I've heard people say that. Could be due to their kids, or it 
could be due to someone partying a bit too hard in Redmond before releasing 
an update. 


0
JoeSpareBedroom
1/3/2010 8:35:44 PM
"SC Tom" <sc@tom.net> wrote in message 
news:uOHwXOLjKHA.1824@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>
>
> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message 
> news:#AtEt#KjKHA.4048@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
>> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
>>> news:OKDWoiKjKHA.5604@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>>>> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>>>> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white
>>>>> paper which what's contained in SP3:
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer
>>>>>
>>>>> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or
>>>>> two ago. It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white
>>>>> paper which applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not
>>>>> wireless, never will be. As close as I get to "networked" (other
>>>>> than the internetZ) is using some VPN software once a month to
>>>>> connect with my employer's system. If a service pack messed with
>>>>> that situation, I'd have to travel to Redmond with a rifle.
>>>>>
>>>>> Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to
>>>>> mention? Something you think NO user should be without?
>>>>>
>>>>> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to
>>>>> describe? Remember, please, that you are under oath.
>>>>
>>>> There is a better way to reach your decision.
>>>>
>>>> If you want to ensure that your system is secure and if you plan on
>>>> using it beyond April, you should upgrade to SP3. SP2 security
>>>> patches will stop being issued this coming April. SP3 will be
>>>> supported through 2014. There is a tried and true method to upgrade to 
>>>> SP3 without any
>>>> consequences, which has been discussed in this newsgroup many times.
>>>> Should you decide to do so, if you are unable to locate the threads
>>>> that outline the "best practices" method, start a new thread and we
>>>> will be happy to guide you.
>>>>
>>>> Finally, if you want to calm yourself down and make it less likely
>>>> you would someday travel long distances with anger and a rifle, you
>>>> need to get into the habit of regulalry imaging your hard drive.
>>>> Before any major upgrade (including SP3), you would of course make
>>>> sure you have a recent image which can be restored just in case.
>>>> This backup plan would also save your butt in the event of *any*
>>>> problem (malware, corrupted hard drive, etc.).
>>>
>>>
>>> Got an imaging program you like?
>>>
>>> I'm only asking these questions because as we all know, there have
>>> been various horror shows connected with minor and major Windows
>>> updates. Some of them have not been acknowledged by Microsoft for a
>>> period of time known as "not acceptable", a measurement whose
>>> validity is defined ONLY by the user.
>>
>> I will definitely agree with you that many people have experienced issues 
>> with Microsoft updates. However, if a person sticks *only* to critical 
>> security updates (which is what I always recommend -- and DEFINITELY 
>> avoid drivers, too!), the chances of a bad update are quite low. Also, 
>> more often than not, simply uninstalling the update fixes the issue.
>>
>> That being said, in those rare instances where a Windows update does 
>> break a system, an image that can be restored can be a godsend!
>>
>> I like Acronis True Image Home. Its major advantage is you can make quick 
>> incremental images after you have made the initial full image. But it's 
>> not free.
>>
>> If you are looking for a good free imaging program, I have had success 
>> with DriveImageXML. Its downside is that you can't make incremental 
>> images. Also, you would need to create an emergency bootable CD (like 
>> UBCD4Win) in order to restore the image. But by golly, it does work!
>>
>> An alternative to imaging is cloning, where you wind up with an identical 
>> cloned hard drive, which of course would be bootable since it is 
>> identical. Some people prefer this method to imaging. Although Acronis 
>> True Image Home also offers a cloning option, you cannot create 
>> incremental clones with it. For that feature, you would need to use 
>> Casper.
>>
>> There are many options. Different people favor different solutions. I 
>> like Acronis True Image Home, personally.
>>
> If you own a Western Digital, Seagate, or Maxtor internal or external hard 
> drive, you can get Acronis True Image for free. It's not the full-featured 
> version, but works very well. Saved my butt a couple of times :-)
> -- 
> SC Tom


The web page says "helps you to completely clone your current system drive 
onto your new WD hard drive." Do you happen to know if it'll place the image 
onto a drive OTHER THAN a new WD HD? Like a Seagate external HD? 


0
JoeSpareBedroom
1/3/2010 8:38:01 PM
<snip>

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> One must wonder what happens to thousands of ***customers*** who
> have auto update turned on because they trust the process and don't
> think any pre-rape research is needed.  "My machine's a year old,
> but it's a mess so I'm buying a new one." I've heard people say
> that. Could be due to their kids, or it could be due to someone
> partying a bit too hard in Redmond before releasing an update.

Ignorance is often *not* bliss.  ;-)

A computer is not a toaster - but people treat it like many of the other 
appliances they have in their home they believe require no maintenance.  I 
have also seen people throw away plain old toasters because they did not 
seem to heat like they used to - when all they had to do was empty the 
crumbs so that the heating element didn't get switched off so fast because 
of so little room/so much reflected heat. ;-)

A computer is still a sophisticated piece of equipment - although most just 
want what they always want:  it should just work.  Real world - things do 
not work that way.

I would say - given the age of SP3 and the number of complaints I have seen 
since its release - the number of customers that have had issues versus 
those who did not...  the number without issues is much larger.  One could 
argue that most just don't know where to complain - but honestly - if it 
affected enough people, the mass media would be involved much more heavily 
than I ever noticed with SP3.

*shrug*

-- 
Shenan Stanley
     MS-MVP
-- 
How To Ask Questions The Smart Way
http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html 


0
Shenan
1/3/2010 8:44:02 PM
"Shenan Stanley" <newshelper@gmail.com> wrote in message 
news:%23CQXEWLjKHA.4912@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
>
> <snip>
>
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> One must wonder what happens to thousands of ***customers*** who
>> have auto update turned on because they trust the process and don't
>> think any pre-rape research is needed.  "My machine's a year old,
>> but it's a mess so I'm buying a new one." I've heard people say
>> that. Could be due to their kids, or it could be due to someone
>> partying a bit too hard in Redmond before releasing an update.
>
> Ignorance is often *not* bliss.  ;-)
>
> A computer is not a toaster - but people treat it like many of the other 
> appliances they have in their home they believe require no maintenance.  I 
> have also seen people throw away plain old toasters because they did not 
> seem to heat like they used to - when all they had to do was empty the 
> crumbs so that the heating element didn't get switched off so fast because 
> of so little room/so much reflected heat. ;-)
>
> A computer is still a sophisticated piece of equipment - although most 
> just want what they always want:  it should just work.  Real world - 
> things do not work that way.
>
> I would say - given the age of SP3 and the number of complaints I have 
> seen since its release - the number of customers that have had issues 
> versus those who did not...  the number without issues is much larger. 
> One could argue that most just don't know where to complain - but 
> honestly - if it affected enough people, the mass media would be involved 
> much more heavily than I ever noticed with SP3.
>
> *shrug*
>
> -- 
> Shenan Stanley
>     MS-MVP


I forget which update it was that "fixed" OE so that people couldn't view 
attachments without an extra step. Good idea, but it would've been lovely if 
the MS kiddies figured out a way to put a HUGE dialog box on the screen to 
inform users of the change. I recall hundreds of messages in one of the MS 
newsgroups....

Meanwhile, in Redmond, I'm sure there was much laughter and merriment about 
the prank. 


0
JoeSpareBedroom
1/3/2010 8:53:38 PM
<snip>

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> I forget which update it was that "fixed" OE so that people
> couldn't view attachments without an extra step. Good idea, but it
> would've been lovely if the MS kiddies figured out a way to put a
> HUGE dialog box on the screen to inform users of the change. I
> recall hundreds of messages in one of the MS newsgroups....
>
> Meanwhile, in Redmond, I'm sure there was much laughter and
> merriment about the prank.

Doubtful - but whatever conspiracy theory floats your boat. ;-)

Mistakes can/do and will happen.  If anyone ever invents anything that 
satisfies everyone all the time - this will all be moot. ;-)

-- 
Shenan Stanley
     MS-MVP
-- 
How To Ask Questions The Smart Way
http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html 


0
Shenan
1/3/2010 9:01:44 PM

"JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> wrote in message 
news:Ge70n.5566$_H7.3716@newsfe24.iad...
> "SC Tom" <sc@tom.net> wrote in message 
> news:uOHwXOLjKHA.1824@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>>
>>
>> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message 
>> news:#AtEt#KjKHA.4048@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
<snip>
>>>
>>> There are many options. Different people favor different solutions. I 
>>> like Acronis True Image Home, personally.
>>>
>> If you own a Western Digital, Seagate, or Maxtor internal or external 
>> hard drive, you can get Acronis True Image for free. It's not the 
>> full-featured version, but works very well. Saved my butt a couple of 
>> times :-)
>> -- 
>> SC Tom
>
>
> The web page says "helps you to completely clone your current system drive 
> onto your new WD hard drive." Do you happen to know if it'll place the 
> image onto a drive OTHER THAN a new WD HD? Like a Seagate external HD?
>
It will clone it to anywhere you want. I have a Hitachi HDD in my notebook 
that I clone on a regular basis to a WD My Book external drive using ATI for 
WD.
-- 
SC Tom
 

0
SC
1/3/2010 9:09:06 PM
"Shenan Stanley" <newshelper@gmail.com> wrote in message 
news:OyUd9fLjKHA.2164@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
> <snip>
>
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> I forget which update it was that "fixed" OE so that people
>> couldn't view attachments without an extra step. Good idea, but it
>> would've been lovely if the MS kiddies figured out a way to put a
>> HUGE dialog box on the screen to inform users of the change. I
>> recall hundreds of messages in one of the MS newsgroups....
>>
>> Meanwhile, in Redmond, I'm sure there was much laughter and
>> merriment about the prank.
>
> Doubtful - but whatever conspiracy theory floats your boat. ;-)
>
> Mistakes can/do and will happen.  If anyone ever invents anything that 
> satisfies everyone all the time - this will all be moot. ;-)
>
> -- 
> Shenan Stanley
>     MS-MVP


When a mistake as simple as the one above is made, do you guys report the 
unbelievable number of complaints to Redmond? It must get monotonous cutting 
& pasting the same explanation 649 billion times.

Some of the errors remind me of a beauty which myspace is famous for:  "An 
unknown error has occurred. Technical services has been informed." Uh....no. 
Clicking on "Home" does not produce an "unknown error" for two years 
running, unless the myspace founder spent all of Rupert Murdoch's buyout 
money on beer instead of hiring some real programmers. 


0
JoeSpareBedroom
1/3/2010 9:10:28 PM
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
> news:%23AtEt%23KjKHA.4048@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
>> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
>>> news:OKDWoiKjKHA.5604@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>>>> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>>>> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white
>>>>> paper which what's contained in SP3:
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer
>>>>>
>>>>> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day
>>>>> or two ago. It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the
>>>>> white paper which applies to my computing situation. Desktop
>>>>> machine, not wireless, never will be. As close as I get to
>>>>> "networked" (other than the internetZ) is using some VPN software
>>>>> once a month to connect with my employer's system. If a service
>>>>> pack messed with that situation, I'd have to travel to Redmond
>>>>> with a rifle. Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you 
>>>>> would like to
>>>>> mention? Something you think NO user should be without?
>>>>>
>>>>> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to
>>>>> describe? Remember, please, that you are under oath.
>>>>
>>>> There is a better way to reach your decision.
>>>>
>>>> If you want to ensure that your system is secure and if you plan on
>>>> using it beyond April, you should upgrade to SP3. SP2 security
>>>> patches will stop being issued this coming April. SP3 will be
>>>> supported through 2014. There is a tried and true method to
>>>> upgrade to SP3 without any
>>>> consequences, which has been discussed in this newsgroup many
>>>> times. Should you decide to do so, if you are unable to locate the
>>>> threads that outline the "best practices" method, start a new
>>>> thread and we will be happy to guide you.
>>>>
>>>> Finally, if you want to calm yourself down and make it less likely
>>>> you would someday travel long distances with anger and a rifle, you
>>>> need to get into the habit of regulalry imaging your hard drive.
>>>> Before any major upgrade (including SP3), you would of course make
>>>> sure you have a recent image which can be restored just in case.
>>>> This backup plan would also save your butt in the event of *any*
>>>> problem (malware, corrupted hard drive, etc.).
>>>
>>>
>>> Got an imaging program you like?
>>>
>>> I'm only asking these questions because as we all know, there have
>>> been various horror shows connected with minor and major Windows
>>> updates. Some of them have not been acknowledged by Microsoft for a
>>> period of time known as "not acceptable", a measurement whose
>>> validity is defined ONLY by the user.
>>
>> I will definitely agree with you that many people have experienced
>> issues with Microsoft updates. However, if a person sticks *only* to
>> critical security updates (which is what I always recommend -- and
>> DEFINITELY avoid drivers, too!), the chances of a bad update are
>> quite low. Also, more often than not, simply uninstalling the update
>> fixes the issue. That being said, in those rare instances where a 
>> Windows update does
>> break a system, an image that can be restored can be a godsend!
>>
>> I like Acronis True Image Home. Its major advantage is you can make
>> quick incremental images after you have made the initial full image.
>> But it's not free.
>>
>> If you are looking for a good free imaging program, I have had
>> success with DriveImageXML. Its downside is that you can't make
>> incremental images. Also, you would need to create an emergency
>> bootable CD (like UBCD4Win) in order to restore the image. But by
>> golly, it does work! An alternative to imaging is cloning, where you 
>> wind up with an
>> identical cloned hard drive, which of course would be bootable since
>> it is identical. Some people prefer this method to imaging. Although
>> Acronis True Image Home also offers a cloning option, you cannot
>> create incremental clones with it. For that feature, you would need
>> to use Casper.
>>
>> There are many options. Different people favor different solutions.
>> I like Acronis True Image Home, personally.
>>
>
>
> Aside from the disadvantage of the disk space it occupies, would
> setting a restore point before the update achieve the same thing?

Although highly recommended, setting a Restore Point won't achieve the 
same thing. It's possible that an update or piece of malware or bad 
piece of hardware would cause a situation where the PC can't boot. 
Without being able to boot into Windows, System Restore is useless.

That being said, SR has helped me tremendously a few times (and it's 
*much* quicker than restoring an image!). Always a good tool to have in 
the arsenal... 


0
Daave
1/3/2010 9:15:10 PM
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
> news:%23AtEt%23KjKHA.4048@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
>> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
>>> news:OKDWoiKjKHA.5604@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>>>> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>>>> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white
>>>>> paper which what's contained in SP3:
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer
>>>>>
>>>>> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or
>>>>> two ago. It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white
>>>>> paper which applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not
>>>>> wireless, never will be. As close as I get to "networked" (other
>>>>> than the internetZ) is using some VPN software once a month to
>>>>> connect with my employer's system. If a service pack messed with
>>>>> that situation, I'd have to travel to Redmond with a rifle.
>>>>>
>>>>> Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to
>>>>> mention? Something you think NO user should be without?
>>>>>
>>>>> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to
>>>>> describe? Remember, please, that you are under oath.
>>>>
>>>> There is a better way to reach your decision.
>>>>
>>>> If you want to ensure that your system is secure and if you plan on
>>>> using it beyond April, you should upgrade to SP3. SP2 security
>>>> patches will stop being issued this coming April. SP3 will be
>>>> supported through 2014. There is a tried and true method to upgrade to
>>>> SP3 without any
>>>> consequences, which has been discussed in this newsgroup many times.
>>>> Should you decide to do so, if you are unable to locate the threads
>>>> that outline the "best practices" method, start a new thread and we
>>>> will be happy to guide you.
>>>>
>>>> Finally, if you want to calm yourself down and make it less likely
>>>> you would someday travel long distances with anger and a rifle, you
>>>> need to get into the habit of regulalry imaging your hard drive.
>>>> Before any major upgrade (including SP3), you would of course make
>>>> sure you have a recent image which can be restored just in case.
>>>> This backup plan would also save your butt in the event of *any*
>>>> problem (malware, corrupted hard drive, etc.).
>>>
>>>
>>> Got an imaging program you like?
>>>
>>> I'm only asking these questions because as we all know, there have
>>> been various horror shows connected with minor and major Windows
>>> updates. Some of them have not been acknowledged by Microsoft for a
>>> period of time known as "not acceptable", a measurement whose
>>> validity is defined ONLY by the user.
>>
>> I will definitely agree with you that many people have experienced issues
>> with Microsoft updates. However, if a person sticks *only* to critical
>> security updates (which is what I always recommend -- and DEFINITELY 
>> avoid drivers, too!), the chances of a bad update are quite low. Also, 
>> more
>> often than not, simply uninstalling the update fixes the issue.
>>
>> That being said, in those rare instances where a Windows update does 
>> break
>> a system, an image that can be restored can be a godsend!
>>
>> I like Acronis True Image Home. Its major advantage is you can make quick
>> incremental images after you have made the initial full image. But it's
>> not free.
>>
>> If you are looking for a good free imaging program, I have had success
>> with DriveImageXML. Its downside is that you can't make incremental
>> images. Also, you would need to create an emergency bootable CD (like
>> UBCD4Win) in order to restore the image. But by golly, it does work!
>>
>> An alternative to imaging is cloning, where you wind up with an identical
>> cloned hard drive, which of course would be bootable since it is
>> identical. Some people prefer this method to imaging. Although Acronis
>> True Image Home also offers a cloning option, you cannot create
>> incremental clones with it. For that feature, you would need to use
>> Casper.
>>
>> There are many options. Different people favor different solutions. I 
>> like
>> Acronis True Image Home, personally.
>>
>
>
> Aside from the disadvantage of the disk space it occupies, would setting a
> restore point before the update achieve the same thing?

No.   System Restore is much more limited in what it can and cannot do. 
(that said, it's still a good idea to have it available as an option).

Imaging or cloning are the only true solutions for a backup, should anything 
go wrong, or should you wish to revert back to a clean system.   And the 
cost for such programs is minimal, in the final analysis. 


0
Bill
1/3/2010 9:16:22 PM
"SC Tom" <sc@tom.net> wrote in message 
news:%23xRk9jLjKHA.4672@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
>
>
> "JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> wrote in message 
> news:Ge70n.5566$_H7.3716@newsfe24.iad...
>> "SC Tom" <sc@tom.net> wrote in message 
>> news:uOHwXOLjKHA.1824@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>>>
>>>
>>> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message 
>>> news:#AtEt#KjKHA.4048@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
> <snip>
>>>>
>>>> There are many options. Different people favor different solutions. I 
>>>> like Acronis True Image Home, personally.
>>>>
>>> If you own a Western Digital, Seagate, or Maxtor internal or external 
>>> hard drive, you can get Acronis True Image for free. It's not the 
>>> full-featured version, but works very well. Saved my butt a couple of 
>>> times :-)
>>> -- 
>>> SC Tom
>>
>>
>> The web page says "helps you to completely clone your current system 
>> drive onto your new WD hard drive." Do you happen to know if it'll place 
>> the image onto a drive OTHER THAN a new WD HD? Like a Seagate external 
>> HD?
>>
> It will clone it to anywhere you want. I have a Hitachi HDD in my notebook 
> that I clone on a regular basis to a WD My Book external drive using ATI 
> for WD.
> -- 
> SC Tom


This is too good to be true. I have a WD hard drive. I see the web site. 
There's gotta be a catch. No downloads on Sunday for anyone with a beard, 
maybe? 


0
JoeSpareBedroom
1/3/2010 9:21:08 PM
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> When a mistake as simple as the one above is made, do you guys
> report the unbelievable number of complaints to Redmond? It must
> get monotonous cutting & pasting the same explanation 649 billion
> times.
> Some of the errors remind me of a beauty which myspace is famous
> for:  "An unknown error has occurred. Technical services has been
> informed." Uh....no. Clicking on "Home" does not produce an
> "unknown error" for two years running, unless the myspace founder
> spent all of Rupert Murdoch's buyout money on beer instead of
> hiring some real programmers.

Not only do those at Microsoft notice, but yes - some of us report it as 
well.  Not like we have any more pull than everyone else reporting it 
though... Do you report it?  ;-)

As far as tiring and cutting & pasting - to this day because people don't 
listen to detailed instructions but make up their own - I copy/paste the 
same answers each day - even though I may have done the same response in the 
same conversation already.

-- 
Shenan Stanley
     MS-MVP
-- 
How To Ask Questions The Smart Way
http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html 


0
Shenan
1/3/2010 9:35:24 PM
On Jan 3, 3:20=A0pm, "Larry" <re...@group.com> wrote:
> SP-3 is listed in the updates in Add/Remove programs, so it can be easily
> uninstalled.
>
> ****
>
> "JoeSpareBedroom" <newstr...@frontiernet.net> wrote in message
>
> news:li50n.1663$nR4.1359@newsfe01.iad...
> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white paper
> which what's contained in SP3:
>
> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=3D68C48DAD-BC3..=
..
>
> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or two a=
go.
> It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white paper which
> applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not wireless, never w=
ill
> be. As close as I get to "networked" (other than the internetZ) is using
> some VPN software once a month to connect with my employer's system. If a
> service pack messed with that situation, I'd have to travel to Redmond wi=
th
> a rifle.
>
> Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to mention?
> Something you think NO user should be without?
>
> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to describe?
> Remember, please, that you are under oath.

What bugs did you get rid of?

What system problems did you resolve that were the result of your own
hand?

Wasn't your last problem "resolved" by uninstalling software that you
chose to install yourself - wasn't it uninstalling ZoneAlarm that
brought back your snappiness?

ZA can be fairly complicated and if not configured properly, it can be
an issue.  If you get it tuned up for your system it works great, but
usually not out of the box.  That's what happens when you download a
good product and don't know how to use it properly or bother to figure
it out.

Here is the list of SP3 updates you can read and see if they might be
useful to you.

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/946480

If you install SP3 and other items on your system are out of date or
incompatible with the updates you may indeed have some issues, but it
is probably not the "fault" of SP3.

Since the new issues seem to come after the SP3 update, SP3 usually
ends up being the fall guy.  It is easy to blame.

I predict you will have a batch of new issues on or about 1/13/10.


0
Jose
1/3/2010 9:42:17 PM
"Shenan Stanley" <newshelper@gmail.com> wrote in message 
news:uxkgxyLjKHA.5020@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> When a mistake as simple as the one above is made, do you guys
>> report the unbelievable number of complaints to Redmond? It must
>> get monotonous cutting & pasting the same explanation 649 billion
>> times.
>> Some of the errors remind me of a beauty which myspace is famous
>> for:  "An unknown error has occurred. Technical services has been
>> informed." Uh....no. Clicking on "Home" does not produce an
>> "unknown error" for two years running, unless the myspace founder
>> spent all of Rupert Murdoch's buyout money on beer instead of
>> hiring some real programmers.
>
> Not only do those at Microsoft notice, but yes - some of us report it as 
> well.  Not like we have any more pull than everyone else reporting it 
> though... Do you report it?  ;-)
>
> As far as tiring and cutting & pasting - to this day because people don't 
> listen to detailed instructions but make up their own - I copy/paste the 
> same answers each day - even though I may have done the same response in 
> the same conversation already.


I noticed. :-) 


0
JoeSpareBedroom
1/3/2010 9:43:02 PM
"Jose" <jose_ease@yahoo.com> wrote in message 
news:192cf8c1-5dcb-47cc-8946-fe020abdab3e@k23g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
On Jan 3, 3:20 pm, "Larry" <re...@group.com> wrote:
> SP-3 is listed in the updates in Add/Remove programs, so it can be easily
> uninstalled.
>
> ****
>
> "JoeSpareBedroom" <newstr...@frontiernet.net> wrote in message
>
> news:li50n.1663$nR4.1359@newsfe01.iad...
> I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white paper
> which what's contained in SP3:
>
> http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC3...
>
> I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or two 
> ago.
> It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white paper which
> applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not wireless, never 
> will
> be. As close as I get to "networked" (other than the internetZ) is using
> some VPN software once a month to connect with my employer's system. If a
> service pack messed with that situation, I'd have to travel to Redmond 
> with
> a rifle.
>
> Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to mention?
> Something you think NO user should be without?
>
> How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to describe?
> Remember, please, that you are under oath.

What bugs did you get rid of?

What system problems did you resolve that were the result of your own
hand?

Wasn't your last problem "resolved" by uninstalling software that you
chose to install yourself - wasn't it uninstalling ZoneAlarm that
brought back your snappiness?

ZA can be fairly complicated and if not configured properly, it can be
an issue.  If you get it tuned up for your system it works great, but
usually not out of the box.  That's what happens when you download a
good product and don't know how to use it properly or bother to figure
it out.

Here is the list of SP3 updates you can read and see if they might be
useful to you.

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/946480

If you install SP3 and other items on your system are out of date or
incompatible with the updates you may indeed have some issues, but it
is probably not the "fault" of SP3.

Since the new issues seem to come after the SP3 update, SP3 usually
ends up being the fall guy.  It is easy to blame.

I predict you will have a batch of new issues on or about 1/13/10.
================


Two (and probably more I'm not aware of) sources spend quite a bit of time 
helping users dig themselves out holes created by MS updates. I'm not saying 
*all* the updates are evil, but all informed users know that *some* updates 
are evil. 


0
JoeSpareBedroom
1/3/2010 9:44:55 PM
"JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> wrote in
news:eA60n.5561$_H7.5245@newsfe24.iad: 

> "db" <databaseben@hotmail.com> wrote in message 
> news:OjMTtuKjKHA.1824@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>> well, I would leave well enough
>> alone especially if you are feeling
>> very happy with the system and
>> your setup.
>>
>> upgrading to the newer o.s., i.e.
>> vista or win7 would be the
>> advantageous thing.
> 
> 
> OK - I'll bite. Why would it be to my advantage to switch*
> to Vista or Win7? 
> 
> * "upgrade" not proven yet in this discussion. 

Joe - I don't have the patience to read the whole thread, I 
wouldn't be surprised if some people had told you to switch to 
Linux.

"If it ain't broke, don't fix it". Period. SP 3 is largely 
unnecessary - I have read a few articles which basically plainly 
tell you that, and I have yet to see a program mentioning it 
requires SP3 - some say "XP with SP2", some say just "XP".

Forget about Vista or Win7. XP is enough work to keep running 
well. Th ONLY advantages the new OS's offer is to MS and 
hardware vendors. All the stuff every new Win release promises 
has been EXACTLY the same since Win 3.11. Stupid "make life 
easier but fuck up your system" features, the ever-present "IT'S 
SO MUCH FASTER!" (HAH!), etc. But no one told you you needed at 
least 512 MB of RAM for XP and brand name machines were sold all 
over the world with 128 or 256 MB. When they ran like crap, you 
had to go through the "get more RAM XPerience".

Just like no one told you need 4GB of RAM to enjoy the Vista 
"Aero" look. WHO GIVES A SHIT ABOUT CRAP LIKE THAT?

You have it running perfectly - make an image of the C: drive 
(Acronis or Ghost) and keep it in a safe place and be happy your 
machine works like it should.

Cheers,
t.
0
thanatoid
1/3/2010 9:45:49 PM
I can safely say that there are
always some added improvements
and features in the newer o.s.'s

however, you will probably
ask me what they are.

so you'll probably need to buy
a fresh box of bagels for this

and create a new thread / discussion
for the topic


-- 
db���`�...�><)))�>
DatabaseBen, Retired Professional
 - Systems Analyst
 - Database Developer
 - Accountancy
 - Veteran of the Armed Forces
-  @Hotmail.com
-  nntp Postologist
~ "share the nirvana" - dbZen

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>

"JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> wrote in message 
news:eA60n.5561$_H7.5245@newsfe24.iad...
> "db" <databaseben@hotmail.com> wrote in message 
> news:OjMTtuKjKHA.1824@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>> well, I would leave well enough
>> alone especially if you are feeling
>> very happy with the system and
>> your setup.
>>
>> upgrading to the newer o.s., i.e.
>> vista or win7 would be the
>> advantageous thing.
>
>
> OK - I'll bite. Why would it be to my advantage to switch* to Vista or 
> Win7?
>
> * "upgrade" not proven yet in this discussion.
> 
0
db
1/3/2010 9:55:54 PM
"db" <databaseben@hotmail.com> wrote in message 
news:OHrrK%23LjKHA.2132@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
>I can safely say that there are
> always some added improvements
> and features in the newer o.s.'s
>

I'm the customer. I have not stated a need for a new product. Therefore, any 
new features you might mention have no meaning to me, unless a new Windows 
version is capable of emptying my dishwasher and causing a painful death for 
a couple of irresponsible dog owners in my neighborhood.


> however, you will probably
> ask me what they are.
>

No, actually.


> so you'll probably need to buy
> a fresh box of bagels for this
>
> and create a new thread / discussion
> for the topic

Please don't. I'm begging you. 


0
JoeSpareBedroom
1/3/2010 10:06:55 PM
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> "db" <databaseben@hotmail.com> wrote in message 
> news:OHrrK%23LjKHA.2132@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
>> I can safely say that there are
>> always some added improvements
>> and features in the newer o.s.'s
>>
> 
> I'm the customer. I have not stated a need for a new product. Therefore, any 
> new features you might mention have no meaning to me, unless a new Windows 
> version is capable of emptying my dishwasher and causing a painful death for 
> a couple of irresponsible dog owners in my neighborhood.
> 
> 
>> however, you will probably
>> ask me what they are.
>>
> 
> No, actually.
> 
> 
>> so you'll probably need to buy
>> a fresh box of bagels for this
>>
>> and create a new thread / discussion
>> for the topic
> 
> Please don't. I'm begging you. 
> 
> 



LOL

the only reason I have not killfiled "db"
is because it's nice to know there is at least one person on Usenet even 
dumber than I am


That said: I have applied sp3 to a large number of XP machines
and have never had a problem...and in some cases found slightly improved 
performance.

Of course it's not a bad idea to clone your HD first

Though it has also included a number of security updates
the sad matter is...no version of Windows has protection against root 
kits...and that's becoming a serious problem.
0
philo
1/3/2010 10:14:13 PM
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> "db" <databaseben@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:OHrrK%23LjKHA.2132@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
>> I can safely say that there are
>> always some added improvements
>> and features in the newer o.s.'s
>>
>
> I'm the customer. I have not stated a need for a new product.
> Therefore, any new features you might mention have no meaning to me,
> unless a new Windows version is capable of emptying my dishwasher and
> causing a painful death for a couple of irresponsible dog owners in
> my neighborhood.

There is talk that Windows 8 will do just that.

>> however, you will probably
>> ask me what they are.
>>
>
> No, actually.

Smart move. :-)

db as you can see is pretty much only capable of blowing hot air. You 
may want to introduce him to your killfile... (I'm pretty sure that 
would be one of Windows 8's defaults; one can only hope!) 


0
Daave
1/3/2010 10:17:51 PM
There is generally no need to have any service packs (never mind SP3) 
especially if you are  not likely to install  any new application 
packages or any new updates from M$.

Having said so, Service Packs are free and you have nothing to lose 
apart from losing the habit of your system which crashes from time to 
time because M$ programmers forgot to correct something when your 
original system was dispatched but now they managed to issue a new patch 
or service pack to correct it.

I have installed SP3 and all updates since then and I have also saved 
these on a DVD just in case I need to re-install the OS in the future.  
M$ has the habit of removing Service Packs and patches from its servers 
when they are no longer supported.  This does not mean you can't 
continue using it .

I take it you don't like adventures in life right?  Installing SPs is an 
experience you should have if you are interested in computers and other 
high tech systems.

hth


JoeSpareBedroom wrote:

>I'm sitting here eating a nice bagel and reading a Microsoft white paper 
>which what's contained in SP3:
>
>http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=68C48DAD-BC34-40BE-8D85-6BB4F56F5110&displaylang=en#QuickInfoContainer
>
>I've just gotten some bugs OUT of my desktop machine as of a day or two ago. 
>It's running beautifully. I don't see anything in the white paper which 
>applies to my computing situation. Desktop machine, not wireless, never will 
>be. As close as I get to "networked" (other than the internetZ) is using 
>some VPN software once a month to connect with my employer's system. If a 
>service pack messed with that situation, I'd have to travel to Redmond with 
>a rifle.
>
>Is there a favorite fix in SP3 which any of you would like to mention? 
>Something you think NO user should be without?
>
>How about anything BROKEN by SP3 which any of you would like to describe? 
>Remember, please, that you are under oath. 
>
>
>  
>
0
ANONYMOUS
1/3/2010 10:31:39 PM
"Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message 
news:uzpocKMjKHA.5520@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
>
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> "db" <databaseben@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:OHrrK%23LjKHA.2132@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
>>> I can safely say that there are
>>> always some added improvements
>>> and features in the newer o.s.'s
>>>
>>
>> I'm the customer. I have not stated a need for a new product.
>> Therefore, any new features you might mention have no meaning to me,
>> unless a new Windows version is capable of emptying my dishwasher and
>> causing a painful death for a couple of irresponsible dog owners in
>> my neighborhood.
>
> There is talk that Windows 8 will do just that.
>
>>> however, you will probably
>>> ask me what they are.
>>>
>>
>> No, actually.
>
> Smart move. :-)
>
> db as you can see is pretty much only capable of blowing hot air. You may 
> want to introduce him to your killfile... (I'm pretty sure that would be 
> one of Windows 8's defaults; one can only hope!)
>


Nah. He's just likes to see his moniker online, even if he's saying nothing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKyJaLZb3AE 


0
JoeSpareBedroom
1/3/2010 11:26:22 PM
"ANONYMOUS" <ANONYMOUS@EXAMPLE.COM> wrote in message 
news:ef9JGSMjKHA.2160@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...

>
> I take it you don't like adventures in life right?

Au contraire. But to me, a computer is just a tool, not a hobby. I prefer 
musical adventures. 


0
JoeSpareBedroom
1/3/2010 11:29:50 PM

"JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> wrote in message 
news:6T70n.5575$_H7.2185@newsfe24.iad...
> "SC Tom" <sc@tom.net> wrote in message 
> news:%23xRk9jLjKHA.4672@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
>>
>>
>> "JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> wrote in message 
>> news:Ge70n.5566$_H7.3716@newsfe24.iad...
>>> "SC Tom" <sc@tom.net> wrote in message 
>>> news:uOHwXOLjKHA.1824@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message 
>>>> news:#AtEt#KjKHA.4048@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
>> <snip>
>>>>>
>>>>> There are many options. Different people favor different solutions. I 
>>>>> like Acronis True Image Home, personally.
>>>>>
>>>> If you own a Western Digital, Seagate, or Maxtor internal or external 
>>>> hard drive, you can get Acronis True Image for free. It's not the 
>>>> full-featured version, but works very well. Saved my butt a couple of 
>>>> times :-)
>>>> -- 
>>>> SC Tom
>>>
>>>
>>> The web page says "helps you to completely clone your current system 
>>> drive onto your new WD hard drive." Do you happen to know if it'll place 
>>> the image onto a drive OTHER THAN a new WD HD? Like a Seagate external 
>>> HD?
>>>
>> It will clone it to anywhere you want. I have a Hitachi HDD in my 
>> notebook that I clone on a regular basis to a WD My Book external drive 
>> using ATI for WD.
>> -- 
>> SC Tom
>
>
> This is too good to be true. I have a WD hard drive. I see the web site. 
> There's gotta be a catch. No downloads on Sunday for anyone with a beard, 
> maybe?

No catch, but like I said, it's not a full-blown version. I don't believe 
it'll do incremental images (I may be wrong; I haven't checked that out), 
but by booting from the CD created after installing it, I can create a full 
image of 55GB of data in about an hour, hour and a half. And that takes up 
about 37GB on my external drive using standard compression. And I think 
there was an offer to upgrade it to the full version for a discounted price.
-- 
SC Tom
 

0
SC
1/3/2010 11:33:41 PM
"JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> �crivait
news:6T70n.5575$_H7.2185@newsfe24.iad: 

> "SC Tom" <sc@tom.net> wrote in message 
> news:%23xRk9jLjKHA.4672@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
>>
>>
>> "JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> wrote in message 
>> news:Ge70n.5566$_H7.3716@newsfe24.iad...
>>> "SC Tom" <sc@tom.net> wrote in message 
>>> news:uOHwXOLjKHA.1824@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message 
>>>> news:#AtEt#KjKHA.4048@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
>> <snip>
>>>>>
>>>>> There are many options. Different people favor different
>>>>> solutions. I like Acronis True Image Home, personally.
>>>>>
>>>> If you own a Western Digital, Seagate, or Maxtor internal or
>>>> external hard drive, you can get Acronis True Image for free. It's
>>>> not the full-featured version, but works very well. Saved my butt a
>>>> couple of times :-)
>>>> -- 
>>>> SC Tom
>>>
>>>
>>> The web page says "helps you to completely clone your current system
>>> drive onto your new WD hard drive." Do you happen to know if it'll
>>> place the image onto a drive OTHER THAN a new WD HD? Like a Seagate
>>> external HD?
>>>
>> It will clone it to anywhere you want. I have a Hitachi HDD in my
>> notebook that I clone on a regular basis to a WD My Book external
>> drive using ATI for WD.
>> -- 
>> SC Tom
> 
> 
> This is too good to be true. I have a WD hard drive. I see the web
> site. There's gotta be a catch. No downloads on Sunday for anyone with
> a beard, maybe? 
> 
> 
> 

It's limited, it won't do incremental backups but it will create images 
on external HD or clone a HD to another one. And I think his installation 
program needs to see a WD hard disk to proceed with the installation (or 
a Seagate disk if you download from Seagate) but since you have a WD 
disk, you're good to go.

For incremental BU, you need to buy ATI from Acronis or a computer store. 

 

0
Doum
1/4/2010 12:15:19 AM
"Doum" <me@domain.net> wrote in message 
news:XnF9CF5C3E9079FCdoumdomainnet@207.46.248.16...
>
> It's limited, it won't do incremental backups but it will create images
> on external HD or clone a HD to another one. And I think his installation
> program needs to see a WD hard disk to proceed with the installation (or
> a Seagate disk if you download from Seagate) but since you have a WD
> disk, you're good to go.
>
> For incremental BU, you need to buy ATI from Acronis or a computer store.
>

That's true. All I had to do was plug in my external WD drive, and 
everything went just fine.
-- 
SC Tom

0
SC
1/4/2010 1:51:13 AM
Sorry.

I didn't mean to sound unhelpful.

Sometimes keeping my lines short
makes me sound short as well.

As you might ascertain from my
experience, adding additional fluff
and unneeded verbiage has never
been appropriate for me.

-------------

I was merely suggesting that it would
be interesting for you to create a new
topic via a new thread.

that way the information you
might receive between the o.s.'s
can be separated by differing
threads.


-- 
db���`�...�><)))�>
DatabaseBen, Retired Professional
 - Systems Analyst
 - Database Developer
 - Accountancy
 - Veteran of the Armed Forces
-  @Hotmail.com
-  nntp Postologist
~ "share the nirvana" - dbZen

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>

"JoeSpareBedroom" <newstrash@frontiernet.net> wrote in message 
news:1y80n.5581$_H7.4729@newsfe24.iad...
> "db" <databaseben@hotmail.com> wrote in message 
> news:OHrrK%23LjKHA.2132@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
>>I can safely say that there are
>> always some added improvements
>> and features in the newer o.s.'s
>>
>
> I'm the customer. I have not stated a need for a new product. Therefore, 
> any new features you might mention have no meaning to me, unless a new 
> Windows version is capable of emptying my dishwasher and causing a painful 
> death for a couple of irresponsible dog owners in my neighborhood.
>
>
>> however, you will probably
>> ask me what they are.
>>
>
> No, actually.
>
>
>> so you'll probably need to buy
>> a fresh box of bagels for this
>>
>> and create a new thread / discussion
>> for the topic
>
> Please don't. I'm begging you.
> 
0
db
1/4/2010 4:33:51 PM
Reply:

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So whats happening with the windows update site ?I keep getting a message telling me there is a problem with the web page (am trying to update new installation of XP Home),is it me or the site,and when will it be sorted out? -- Be happy,Strat4axe "stat4axe" <strat4axe@hotmail.com(donotspam)> wrote in message news:36618CFD-EF82-4F82-A7C3-90CF2DDCCEA5@microsoft.com... > So whats happening with the windows update site ?I keep getting a message > telling me there is a problem with the web page (am trying to update new > installation of XP Home),is it me o...

Updating Boolean Field with onChange
I am having difficulty with setting a value of a new boolean field using the OnChange scripting against a picklist. If anyone has some sample code / formatting information that I can use it would be greatly appreciated. Also, I also need to know if it is possible to stop the default value for the Revenue (isrevenuesystemcalculated) field on the opportunity form being set to "Yes" when the "Convert Lead" function is used. We can set the default value to "No" for user created Opportunities but when Convert Lead is used it seems to ignore the default value. Again, a...