Windows 7 mail

I recently loaded Windows 7.  Basically I like it.  However, the email 
program sucks.   I read in a blog that "Windows Live Mail" was implemented 
with the advertising because "the servers most go to had advertising also".  
I disagree!!!! The servers may have advertising but Outlook/outlook Express 
did not, thus the reason I used OE.  I have a computer training service and I 
have always installed Outlook Express on my clients machines when setting up 
their email, due to the fact they didn't want the ads all over the screen.  
NOW THIS IS NOT EVEN A OPTION.   It is a HUGE mistake for microsoft to 
eliminate Outlook/Outlook Express.  Obviously no common ordinary PC users 
were consulted when designing the email portion of Windows 7.  I'm truly 
disappointed and will probably switch to MAC's also I will  suggest to my 
clients to keep Vista or XP since emailing about the only thing my clients 
use their PC's for.    Please rethink this elimination of Outlook/Outlook 
Express.  Ginny Lane
0
Utf
12/4/2009 8:49:01 PM
windows.vista.mail 2954 articles. 1 followers. Follow

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Why are you stressing over "advertising" when Windows Live Mail
has no ads? Ranting detracts from real problem solving.

What is it about Windows Live Mail that you don't like? Have you
tried it? You can configure it to be pretty much just a dumb email=20
client like Windows Mail.

--=20
Gary VanderMolen, Microsoft MVP (Mail)
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx/profile/vandermolen


"Ginny Lane" <Ginny Lane@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message =
news:102E5752-5E13-4821-9262-A9DA582EFF36@microsoft.com...
>I recently loaded Windows 7.  Basically I like it.  However, the email=20
> program sucks.   I read in a blog that "Windows Live Mail" was =
implemented=20
> with the advertising because "the servers most go to had advertising =
also". =20
> I disagree!!!! The servers may have advertising but Outlook/outlook =
Express=20
> did not, thus the reason I used OE.  I have a computer training =
service and I=20
> have always installed Outlook Express on my clients machines when =
setting up=20
> their email, due to the fact they didn't want the ads all over the =
screen. =20
> NOW THIS IS NOT EVEN A OPTION.   It is a HUGE mistake for microsoft to =

> eliminate Outlook/Outlook Express.  Obviously no common ordinary PC =
users=20
> were consulted when designing the email portion of Windows 7.  I'm =
truly=20
> disappointed and will probably switch to MAC's also I will  suggest to =
my=20
> clients to keep Vista or XP since emailing about the only thing my =
clients=20
> use their PC's for.    Please rethink this elimination of =
Outlook/Outlook=20
> Express.  Ginny Lane
0
Gary
12/4/2009 9:00:20 PM
If you want an outlook express "Lookalike" use Mozilla Thunderbird, and 
there is no email portion of Windows 7. It is WLM. Wisely they made it 
optional, you don't have to use it if you don't want to.

So lets go down the page a bit and observe...

Ginny Lane wrote:
> I recently loaded Windows 7.


Okay, you installed, we will live with that one


   Basically I like it.  However, the email
> program sucks.   I read in a blog that "Windows Live Mail" was implemented

You read in a blog? Hmm

> with the advertising because "the servers most go to had advertising also".  
> I disagree!!!! The servers may have advertising but Outlook/outlook Express 
> did not, thus the reason I used OE.  

Yeah we sympathize with anyone paying you for it...

I have a computer training service and I
> have always installed Outlook Express on my clients machines when setting up 
> their email, due to the fact they didn't want the ads all over the screen.  
> NOW THIS IS NOT EVEN A OPTION.

You never installed Outlook Express it was always provided as part a 
Windows...


    It is a HUGE mistake for microsoft to
> eliminate Outlook/Outlook Express.

Outlook and Outlook express are completely different, some computer 
training service you have eh? Show me where Outlook has been eliminated?

   Obviously no common ordinary PC users
> were consulted when designing the email portion of Windows 7.  I'm truly 
> disappointed and will probably switch to MAC's 

Good for you, pay twice as much money for hardware and software and 
charge you "Clients" twice as much. See how that flies with the economy 
the way it is.

also I will  suggest to my
> clients to keep Vista or XP since emailing about the only thing my clients 
> use their PC's for.    Please rethink this elimination of Outlook/Outlook 
> Express.

Or you could just admit that you don't know anything except Outlook 
Express and your revenue source is drying up...

   Ginny Lane
0
Charlie
12/4/2009 9:36:18 PM
The email program sucked? That's not even possible as Windows 7 does not 
include an email application, I'm glad you didn't train me, your post is so 
full of flaws and misinformation I don't even know where to begin.

-- 


--
"Ginny Lane" <Ginny Lane@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message 
news:102E5752-5E13-4821-9262-A9DA582EFF36@microsoft.com...
>I recently loaded Windows 7.  Basically I like it.  However, the email
> program sucks.   I read in a blog that "Windows Live Mail" was implemented
> with the advertising because "the servers most go to had advertising 
> also".
> I disagree!!!! The servers may have advertising but Outlook/outlook 
> Express
> did not, thus the reason I used OE.  I have a computer training service 
> and I
> have always installed Outlook Express on my clients machines when setting 
> up
> their email, due to the fact they didn't want the ads all over the screen.
> NOW THIS IS NOT EVEN A OPTION.   It is a HUGE mistake for microsoft to
> eliminate Outlook/Outlook Express.  Obviously no common ordinary PC users
> were consulted when designing the email portion of Windows 7.  I'm truly
> disappointed and will probably switch to MAC's also I will  suggest to my
> clients to keep Vista or XP since emailing about the only thing my clients
> use their PC's for.    Please rethink this elimination of Outlook/Outlook
> Express.  Ginny Lane 

0
David
12/4/2009 9:54:17 PM
Windows 7 doesn't have an email program with or without advertising. You 
install whatever email program you want.
Vista does not have Outlook Express



"Ginny Lane" <Ginny Lane@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message 
news:102E5752-5E13-4821-9262-A9DA582EFF36@microsoft.com...
> I recently loaded Windows 7.  Basically I like it.  However, the email
> program sucks.   I read in a blog that "Windows Live Mail" was implemented
> with the advertising because "the servers most go to had advertising 
> also".
> I disagree!!!! The servers may have advertising but Outlook/outlook 
> Express
> did not, thus the reason I used OE.  I have a computer training service 
> and I
> have always installed Outlook Express on my clients machines when setting 
> up
> their email, due to the fact they didn't want the ads all over the screen.
> NOW THIS IS NOT EVEN A OPTION.   It is a HUGE mistake for microsoft to
> eliminate Outlook/Outlook Express.  Obviously no common ordinary PC users
> were consulted when designing the email portion of Windows 7.  I'm truly
> disappointed and will probably switch to MAC's also I will  suggest to my
> clients to keep Vista or XP since emailing about the only thing my clients
> use their PC's for.    Please rethink this elimination of Outlook/Outlook
> Express.  Ginny Lane 

0
Michael
12/4/2009 11:01:23 PM
First, you've posted WLM complaints in the Windows Mail forum (wrong 
newsgroup).  Second, it appears what you installed is simply a link to the 
WLM web-based email, not the desktop version which is very similar to OE. 
Third, OE was included in XP (nothing to install) and not available for 
Vista, or W7.  Fourth, this newsgroup is only monitored by "your peers" 
(used loosely as you don't really seem to know what you're talking about, 
and so are not at par with the "peers" here); this is not where you make 
suggestions to Microsoft (try the "Send Feedback" link on the WLM "Help" 
menu - on the desktop install version).




"Ginny Lane" <Ginny Lane@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message 
news:102E5752-5E13-4821-9262-A9DA582EFF36@microsoft.com...
> I recently loaded Windows 7.  Basically I like it.  However, the email
> program sucks.   I read in a blog that "Windows Live Mail" was implemented
> with the advertising because "the servers most go to had advertising 
> also".
> I disagree!!!! The servers may have advertising but Outlook/outlook 
> Express
> did not, thus the reason I used OE.  I have a computer training service 
> and I
> have always installed Outlook Express on my clients machines when setting 
> up
> their email, due to the fact they didn't want the ads all over the screen.
> NOW THIS IS NOT EVEN A OPTION.   It is a HUGE mistake for microsoft to
> eliminate Outlook/Outlook Express.  Obviously no common ordinary PC users
> were consulted when designing the email portion of Windows 7.  I'm truly
> disappointed and will probably switch to MAC's also I will  suggest to my
> clients to keep Vista or XP since emailing about the only thing my clients
> use their PC's for.    Please rethink this elimination of Outlook/Outlook
> Express.  Ginny Lane 

0
slk759
12/4/2009 11:14:13 PM
Development on OE(included only on XP) and Windows Mail(included only on Vista) ceased over 3 years ago, thus rethinking that 
option regarding either email client seems less than remote.

Outlook(not Outlook Express) is an entirely separate email program and available in all Office suites(except the Home and Student
version). The current version is 2007.
 - Note: If Windows 7, then Outlook 2003 and 2007 are options since Office 2000's lifecycle ended in 2004 and extended support
ceased in July 2009.

Windows 7 does not have an included email program. The only method for Windows Live Mail(WLM) and other Live Essential
applications(Messenger, Photo Gallery, Movie Maker, and Writer) to be present on a Windows 7 system are:
 -  user installable(obtain at download.live.com) or
 - an OEM or System Builder pre-loading Live applications prior to sale.

If at all possible, it might be appropriate to update your computer training documentation to comprehend the above regarding
Windows 7.


-- 
  ...winston
  ms-mvp mail

"Ginny Lane" <Ginny Lane@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message news:102E5752-5E13-4821-9262-A9DA582EFF36@microsoft.com...
> I recently loaded Windows 7.  Basically I like it.  However, the email
> program sucks.   I read in a blog that "Windows Live Mail" was implemented
> with the advertising because "the servers most go to had advertising also".
> I disagree!!!! The servers may have advertising but Outlook/outlook Express
> did not, thus the reason I used OE.  I have a computer training service and I
> have always installed Outlook Express on my clients machines when setting up
> their email, due to the fact they didn't want the ads all over the screen.
> NOW THIS IS NOT EVEN A OPTION.   It is a HUGE mistake for microsoft to
> eliminate Outlook/Outlook Express.  Obviously no common ordinary PC users
> were consulted when designing the email portion of Windows 7.  I'm truly
> disappointed and will probably switch to MAC's also I will  suggest to my
> clients to keep Vista or XP since emailing about the only thing my clients
> use their PC's for.    Please rethink this elimination of Outlook/Outlook
> Express.  Ginny Lane 

0
winston
12/5/2009 5:43:38 AM
Gary,

The problem with Microsoft is that they keep changing their included or 
recommended program.  Outlook Express worked well but was abandoned with 
Vista in favor of Windows Mail.  Now with Windows 7, Windows Mail is 
abandoned and replaced (as a recommendation by Microsoft) with Windows Live 
Mail.  It gets a bit frustrating to constantly have to transfer or convert 
messages and contacts from program to program.

I have noted a few problems with Windows Live Mail (WLM):

1.  When developing message rules, the Apply Now option does not appear to 
work at all.  The rules work for new mail but you can't use it to put your 
existing mail in different folders.

2.  The most serious oversight by Microsoft was to have WLM contacts not be 
the same as Windows Contacts.  I have and iPhone that syncs to the Windows 
Contacts.  I can transfer the Windows contacts to the WLM contacts file but 
there is no sync going forward between the 2 contact lists.  I have to 
remember to change BOTH contact lists if I wish to be current - a ridiculous 
thing to have to do in my opinion.  Microsoft should find a way to sync the 2 
lists.  Further the structure of the two contact lists is not one to one.  
You lose some information when transferring from Windows Contacts to WLM 
contacts.

I just think it was not well thought out.

Stan

"Gary VanderMolen (MVP)" wrote:

> Why are you stressing over "advertising" when Windows Live Mail
> has no ads? Ranting detracts from real problem solving.
> 
> What is it about Windows Live Mail that you don't like? Have you
> tried it? You can configure it to be pretty much just a dumb email 
> client like Windows Mail.
> 
> -- 
> Gary VanderMolen, Microsoft MVP (Mail)
> http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx/profile/vandermolen
> 
> 
> "Ginny Lane" <Ginny Lane@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message news:102E5752-5E13-4821-9262-A9DA582EFF36@microsoft.com...
> >I recently loaded Windows 7.  Basically I like it.  However, the email 
> > program sucks.   I read in a blog that "Windows Live Mail" was implemented 
> > with the advertising because "the servers most go to had advertising also".  
> > I disagree!!!! The servers may have advertising but Outlook/outlook Express 
> > did not, thus the reason I used OE.  I have a computer training service and I 
> > have always installed Outlook Express on my clients machines when setting up 
> > their email, due to the fact they didn't want the ads all over the screen.  
> > NOW THIS IS NOT EVEN A OPTION.   It is a HUGE mistake for microsoft to 
> > eliminate Outlook/Outlook Express.  Obviously no common ordinary PC users 
> > were consulted when designing the email portion of Windows 7.  I'm truly 
> > disappointed and will probably switch to MAC's also I will  suggest to my 
> > clients to keep Vista or XP since emailing about the only thing my clients 
> > use their PC's for.    Please rethink this elimination of Outlook/Outlook 
> > Express.  Ginny Lane
> .
> 
0
Utf
12/6/2009 5:13:01 AM
If Microsoft maintained compatibility with previous software, people would 
complain that they don't improve and instead remain stuck in the past. I 
agree that they often drop support of designs they have gotten us stuck on 
and they often don't do a good job of designing things well in the 
beginning, but at least give them credit for moving forward. They just take 
steps backward every time they take steps forward. If you can do it better, 
go for it.


"Ginny Lane" <Ginny Lane@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message 
news:102E5752-5E13-4821-9262-A9DA582EFF36@microsoft.com...
>I recently loaded Windows 7.  Basically I like it.  However, the email
> program sucks.   I read in a blog that "Windows Live Mail" was implemented
> with the advertising because "the servers most go to had advertising 
> also".
> I disagree!!!! The servers may have advertising but Outlook/outlook 
> Express
> did not, thus the reason I used OE.  I have a computer training service 
> and I
> have always installed Outlook Express on my clients machines when setting 
> up
> their email, due to the fact they didn't want the ads all over the screen.
> NOW THIS IS NOT EVEN A OPTION.   It is a HUGE mistake for microsoft to
> eliminate Outlook/Outlook Express.  Obviously no common ordinary PC users
> were consulted when designing the email portion of Windows 7.  I'm truly
> disappointed and will probably switch to MAC's also I will  suggest to my
> clients to keep Vista or XP since emailing about the only thing my clients
> use their PC's for.    Please rethink this elimination of Outlook/Outlook
> Express.  Ginny Lane 

0
Sam
12/6/2009 6:25:55 AM
Well, Microsoft is not alone with regard to dropping or changing
programs. Look at major car companies like GM dropping major
brands like  Pontiac, Saturn, Saab and Hummer.
It doesn't make financial sense for MS to continue developing two
free mail clients, and Windows Live Mail fits their future plans better.

Problems with Windows Live Mail should be discussed
in its own newsgroup:
http://www.microsoft.com/communities/newsgroups/list/en-us/default.aspx?d=
g=3Dmicrosoft.public.windows.live.mail.desktop
or via your news reader: =
news://msnews.microsoft.com/microsoft.public.windows.live.mail.desktop=20

--=20
Gary VanderMolen, Microsoft MVP (Mail)
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx/profile/vandermolen


"gadgetperson" <gadgetperson@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message =
news:728EA166-C7C8-4AFB-AE0A-A6A88F346B5B@microsoft.com...
> Gary,
>=20
> The problem with Microsoft is that they keep changing their included =
or=20
> recommended program.  Outlook Express worked well but was abandoned =
with=20
> Vista in favor of Windows Mail.  Now with Windows 7, Windows Mail is=20
> abandoned and replaced (as a recommendation by Microsoft) with Windows =
Live=20
> Mail.  It gets a bit frustrating to constantly have to transfer or =
convert=20
> messages and contacts from program to program.
>=20
> I have noted a few problems with Windows Live Mail (WLM):
>=20
> 1.  When developing message rules, the Apply Now option does not =
appear to=20
> work at all.  The rules work for new mail but you can't use it to put =
your=20
> existing mail in different folders.
>=20
> 2.  The most serious oversight by Microsoft was to have WLM contacts =
not be=20
> the same as Windows Contacts.  I have and iPhone that syncs to the =
Windows=20
> Contacts.  I can transfer the Windows contacts to the WLM contacts =
file but=20
> there is no sync going forward between the 2 contact lists.  I have to =

> remember to change BOTH contact lists if I wish to be current - a =
ridiculous=20
> thing to have to do in my opinion.  Microsoft should find a way to =
sync the 2=20
> lists.  Further the structure of the two contact lists is not one to =
one. =20
> You lose some information when transferring from Windows Contacts to =
WLM=20
> contacts.
>=20
> I just think it was not well thought out.
>=20
> Stan
>=20
> "Gary VanderMolen (MVP)" wrote:
>=20
>> Why are you stressing over "advertising" when Windows Live Mail
>> has no ads? Ranting detracts from real problem solving.
>>=20
>> What is it about Windows Live Mail that you don't like? Have you
>> tried it? You can configure it to be pretty much just a dumb email=20
>> client like Windows Mail.
>>=20
>> --=20
>> Gary VanderMolen, Microsoft MVP (Mail)
>> http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx/profile/vandermolen
>>=20
>>=20
>> "Ginny Lane" <Ginny Lane@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message =
news:102E5752-5E13-4821-9262-A9DA582EFF36@microsoft.com...
>> >I recently loaded Windows 7.  Basically I like it.  However, the =
email=20
>> > program sucks.   I read in a blog that "Windows Live Mail" was =
implemented=20
>> > with the advertising because "the servers most go to had =
advertising also". =20
>> > I disagree!!!! The servers may have advertising but Outlook/outlook =
Express=20
>> > did not, thus the reason I used OE.  I have a computer training =
service and I=20
>> > have always installed Outlook Express on my clients machines when =
setting up=20
>> > their email, due to the fact they didn't want the ads all over the =
screen. =20
>> > NOW THIS IS NOT EVEN A OPTION.   It is a HUGE mistake for microsoft =
to=20
>> > eliminate Outlook/Outlook Express.  Obviously no common ordinary PC =
users=20
>> > were consulted when designing the email portion of Windows 7.  I'm =
truly=20
>> > disappointed and will probably switch to MAC's also I will  suggest =
to my=20
>> > clients to keep Vista or XP since emailing about the only thing my =
clients=20
>> > use their PC's for.    Please rethink this elimination of =
Outlook/Outlook=20
>> > Express.  Ginny Lane
>> .
>>
0
Gary
12/6/2009 10:39:48 PM
Many MVPs worked with Microsoft to improve Outlook Express over the years. 
During the development of Vista, OE had a name change to Windows Mail and 
some very nice improvements to the message store were being implemented.  In 
the middle of that, Microsoft decided to abandon OE / WinMail and its users 
and to stop listening to the MVPs and the users, and instead came up with a 
oafish, stupid, and feature poor offspring it termed "Windows Live Mail", 
having inherited the same bugs and generated a new feature set of bugs for 
the users to download for use with Windows 7.  This crapware is now being 
forced down users' throats, and as you can see from the responses, users are 
being blamed for complaining about the crapware and not the authors.  In 
other words, since Microsoft came up with it and you don't like it, then 
that makes you stupid.

Well, screw those people.  You can download Microsoft Virtual PC 2007 and 
install it on a Win7 machine.  Then you can install a version of XP as a 
Virtual Operating system and use that computer within a computer to continue 
to use the feature rich aspects of OE within the Windows 7 environment. 
That way you can continue in the same manner to support your clients, and 
those who love Microsoft's moronic mail can keep using their crapware and 
maintain their bliss.

steve

"Ginny Lane" <Ginny Lane@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message 
news:102E5752-5E13-4821-9262-A9DA582EFF36@microsoft.com...
>I recently loaded Windows 7.  Basically I like it.  However, the email
> program sucks.   I read in a blog that "Windows Live Mail" was implemented
> with the advertising because "the servers most go to had advertising 
> also".
> I disagree!!!! The servers may have advertising but Outlook/outlook 
> Express
> did not, thus the reason I used OE.  I have a computer training service 
> and I
> have always installed Outlook Express on my clients machines when setting 
> up
> their email, due to the fact they didn't want the ads all over the screen.
> NOW THIS IS NOT EVEN A OPTION.   It is a HUGE mistake for microsoft to
> eliminate Outlook/Outlook Express.  Obviously no common ordinary PC users
> were consulted when designing the email portion of Windows 7.  I'm truly
> disappointed and will probably switch to MAC's also I will  suggest to my
> clients to keep Vista or XP since emailing about the only thing my clients
> use their PC's for.    Please rethink this elimination of Outlook/Outlook
> Express.  Ginny Lane 


0
Steve
12/15/2009 2:55:49 PM
What a ridiculous solution, Outlook Express itself has so many flaws who 
would want to implement your solution just to run it?

-- 


--
"Steve Cochran" <scochran@oehelp.com> wrote in message 
news:523C1F7F-93F2-4C25-A84F-15BF5E4514A1@microsoft.com...
> Many MVPs worked with Microsoft to improve Outlook Express over the years. 
> During the development of Vista, OE had a name change to Windows Mail and 
> some very nice improvements to the message store were being implemented. 
> In the middle of that, Microsoft decided to abandon OE / WinMail and its 
> users and to stop listening to the MVPs and the users, and instead came up 
> with a oafish, stupid, and feature poor offspring it termed "Windows Live 
> Mail", having inherited the same bugs and generated a new feature set of 
> bugs for the users to download for use with Windows 7.  This crapware is 
> now being forced down users' throats, and as you can see from the 
> responses, users are being blamed for complaining about the crapware and 
> not the authors.  In other words, since Microsoft came up with it and you 
> don't like it, then that makes you stupid.
>
> Well, screw those people.  You can download Microsoft Virtual PC 2007 and 
> install it on a Win7 machine.  Then you can install a version of XP as a 
> Virtual Operating system and use that computer within a computer to 
> continue to use the feature rich aspects of OE within the Windows 7 
> environment. That way you can continue in the same manner to support your 
> clients, and those who love Microsoft's moronic mail can keep using their 
> crapware and maintain their bliss.
>
> steve
>
> "Ginny Lane" <Ginny Lane@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message 
> news:102E5752-5E13-4821-9262-A9DA582EFF36@microsoft.com...
>>I recently loaded Windows 7.  Basically I like it.  However, the email
>> program sucks.   I read in a blog that "Windows Live Mail" was 
>> implemented
>> with the advertising because "the servers most go to had advertising 
>> also".
>> I disagree!!!! The servers may have advertising but Outlook/outlook 
>> Express
>> did not, thus the reason I used OE.  I have a computer training service 
>> and I
>> have always installed Outlook Express on my clients machines when setting 
>> up
>> their email, due to the fact they didn't want the ads all over the 
>> screen.
>> NOW THIS IS NOT EVEN A OPTION.   It is a HUGE mistake for microsoft to
>> eliminate Outlook/Outlook Express.  Obviously no common ordinary PC users
>> were consulted when designing the email portion of Windows 7.  I'm truly
>> disappointed and will probably switch to MAC's also I will  suggest to my
>> clients to keep Vista or XP since emailing about the only thing my 
>> clients
>> use their PC's for.    Please rethink this elimination of Outlook/Outlook
>> Express.  Ginny Lane
>
> 

0
David
12/15/2009 5:15:02 PM
Some people feel more comfortable with the devil they know than
taking on and learning a new devil.  ;-)

--=20
Gary VanderMolen, Microsoft MVP (Mail)
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx/profile/vandermolen


"David B." <mail@nomail.net> wrote in message =
news:OdqvkoafKHA.2184@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
> What a ridiculous solution, Outlook Express itself has so many flaws =
who=20
> would want to implement your solution just to run it?
>=20
> --=20
>=20
>=20
> --
> "Steve Cochran" <scochran@oehelp.com> wrote in message=20
> news:523C1F7F-93F2-4C25-A84F-15BF5E4514A1@microsoft.com...
>> Many MVPs worked with Microsoft to improve Outlook Express over the =
years.=20
>> During the development of Vista, OE had a name change to Windows Mail =
and=20
>> some very nice improvements to the message store were being =
implemented.=20
>> In the middle of that, Microsoft decided to abandon OE / WinMail and =
its=20
>> users and to stop listening to the MVPs and the users, and instead =
came up=20
>> with a oafish, stupid, and feature poor offspring it termed "Windows =
Live=20
>> Mail", having inherited the same bugs and generated a new feature set =
of=20
>> bugs for the users to download for use with Windows 7.  This crapware =
is=20
>> now being forced down users' throats, and as you can see from the=20
>> responses, users are being blamed for complaining about the crapware =
and=20
>> not the authors.  In other words, since Microsoft came up with it and =
you=20
>> don't like it, then that makes you stupid.
>>
>> Well, screw those people.  You can download Microsoft Virtual PC 2007 =
and=20
>> install it on a Win7 machine.  Then you can install a version of XP =
as a=20
>> Virtual Operating system and use that computer within a computer to=20
>> continue to use the feature rich aspects of OE within the Windows 7=20
>> environment. That way you can continue in the same manner to support =
your=20
>> clients, and those who love Microsoft's moronic mail can keep using =
their=20
>> crapware and maintain their bliss.
>>
>> steve
>>
>> "Ginny Lane" <Ginny Lane@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message=20
>> news:102E5752-5E13-4821-9262-A9DA582EFF36@microsoft.com...
>>>I recently loaded Windows 7.  Basically I like it.  However, the =
email
>>> program sucks.   I read in a blog that "Windows Live Mail" was=20
>>> implemented
>>> with the advertising because "the servers most go to had advertising =

>>> also".
>>> I disagree!!!! The servers may have advertising but Outlook/outlook=20
>>> Express
>>> did not, thus the reason I used OE.  I have a computer training =
service=20
>>> and I
>>> have always installed Outlook Express on my clients machines when =
setting=20
>>> up
>>> their email, due to the fact they didn't want the ads all over the=20
>>> screen.
>>> NOW THIS IS NOT EVEN A OPTION.   It is a HUGE mistake for microsoft =
to
>>> eliminate Outlook/Outlook Express.  Obviously no common ordinary PC =
users
>>> were consulted when designing the email portion of Windows 7.  I'm =
truly
>>> disappointed and will probably switch to MAC's also I will  suggest =
to my
>>> clients to keep Vista or XP since emailing about the only thing my=20
>>> clients
>>> use their PC's for.    Please rethink this elimination of =
Outlook/Outlook
>>> Express.  Ginny Lane
>>
>>=20
>
0
Gary
12/15/2009 6:24:42 PM
Thanks, Steve.
I am one of the people that loved OE, even with all it's limitations. I had 
a yEnc loader and a yahoo pops program so it did everything I wanted. 
Windows mail was not too bad, I still have it on my vista box, but the live 
mail program really sucks. Microsoft wonders why people don't like them. Or 
they don't care. Thunderbird works sorta kinda, but for usenet it is even 
less competant than OE. If MS brought back OE I wouldn't have to hang on to 
XP on my main machine.
regards
S.
"Steve Cochran" <scochran@oehelp.com> wrote in message 
news:523C1F7F-93F2-4C25-A84F-15BF5E4514A1@microsoft.com...
> Many MVPs worked with Microsoft to improve Outlook Express over the years. 
> During the development of Vista, OE had a name change to Windows Mail and 
> some very nice improvements to the message store were being implemented. 
> In the middle of that, Microsoft decided to abandon OE / WinMail and its 
> users and to stop listening to the MVPs and the users, and instead came up 
> with a oafish, stupid, and feature poor offspring it termed "Windows Live 
> Mail", having inherited the same bugs and generated a new feature set of 
> bugs for the users to download for use with Windows 7.  This crapware is 
> now being forced down users' throats, and as you can see from the 
> responses, users are being blamed for complaining about the crapware and 
> not the authors.  In other words, since Microsoft came up with it and you 
> don't like it, then that makes you stupid.
>
> Well, screw those people.  You can download Microsoft Virtual PC 2007 and 
> install it on a Win7 machine.  Then you can install a version of XP as a 
> Virtual Operating system and use that computer within a computer to 
> continue to use the feature rich aspects of OE within the Windows 7 
> environment. That way you can continue in the same manner to support your 
> clients, and those who love Microsoft's moronic mail can keep using their 
> crapware and maintain their bliss.
>
> steve
>
> "Ginny Lane" <Ginny Lane@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message 
> news:102E5752-5E13-4821-9262-A9DA582EFF36@microsoft.com...
>>I recently loaded Windows 7.  Basically I like it.  However, the email
>> program sucks.   I read in a blog that "Windows Live Mail" was 
>> implemented
>> with the advertising because "the servers most go to had advertising 
>> also".
>> I disagree!!!! The servers may have advertising but Outlook/outlook 
>> Express
>> did not, thus the reason I used OE.  I have a computer training service 
>> and I
>> have always installed Outlook Express on my clients machines when setting 
>> up
>> their email, due to the fact they didn't want the ads all over the 
>> screen.
>> NOW THIS IS NOT EVEN A OPTION.   It is a HUGE mistake for microsoft to
>> eliminate Outlook/Outlook Express.  Obviously no common ordinary PC users
>> were consulted when designing the email portion of Windows 7.  I'm truly
>> disappointed and will probably switch to MAC's also I will  suggest to my
>> clients to keep Vista or XP since emailing about the only thing my 
>> clients
>> use their PC's for.    Please rethink this elimination of Outlook/Outlook
>> Express.  Ginny Lane
>
> 

0
stumblingblock
12/16/2009 1:38:07 AM
Outlook Express has flaws? No one would argue with that, but the alternative 
is.....?
"David B." <mail@nomail.net> wrote in message 
news:OdqvkoafKHA.2184@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
> What a ridiculous solution, Outlook Express itself has so many flaws who 
> would want to implement your solution just to run it?
>
> -- 
>
>
> --
> "Steve Cochran" <scochran@oehelp.com> wrote in message 
> news:523C1F7F-93F2-4C25-A84F-15BF5E4514A1@microsoft.com...
>> Many MVPs worked with Microsoft to improve Outlook Express over the 
>> years. During the development of Vista, OE had a name change to Windows 
>> Mail and some very nice improvements to the message store were being 
>> implemented. In the middle of that, Microsoft decided to abandon OE / 
>> WinMail and its users and to stop listening to the MVPs and the users, 
>> and instead came up with a oafish, stupid, and feature poor offspring it 
>> termed "Windows Live Mail", having inherited the same bugs and generated 
>> a new feature set of bugs for the users to download for use with Windows 
>> 7.  This crapware is now being forced down users' throats, and as you can 
>> see from the responses, users are being blamed for complaining about the 
>> crapware and not the authors.  In other words, since Microsoft came up 
>> with it and you don't like it, then that makes you stupid.
>>
>> Well, screw those people.  You can download Microsoft Virtual PC 2007 and 
>> install it on a Win7 machine.  Then you can install a version of XP as a 
>> Virtual Operating system and use that computer within a computer to 
>> continue to use the feature rich aspects of OE within the Windows 7 
>> environment. That way you can continue in the same manner to support your 
>> clients, and those who love Microsoft's moronic mail can keep using their 
>> crapware and maintain their bliss.
>>
>> steve
>>
>> "Ginny Lane" <Ginny Lane@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message 
>> news:102E5752-5E13-4821-9262-A9DA582EFF36@microsoft.com...
>>>I recently loaded Windows 7.  Basically I like it.  However, the email
>>> program sucks.   I read in a blog that "Windows Live Mail" was 
>>> implemented
>>> with the advertising because "the servers most go to had advertising 
>>> also".
>>> I disagree!!!! The servers may have advertising but Outlook/outlook 
>>> Express
>>> did not, thus the reason I used OE.  I have a computer training service 
>>> and I
>>> have always installed Outlook Express on my clients machines when 
>>> setting up
>>> their email, due to the fact they didn't want the ads all over the 
>>> screen.
>>> NOW THIS IS NOT EVEN A OPTION.   It is a HUGE mistake for microsoft to
>>> eliminate Outlook/Outlook Express.  Obviously no common ordinary PC 
>>> users
>>> were consulted when designing the email portion of Windows 7.  I'm truly
>>> disappointed and will probably switch to MAC's also I will  suggest to 
>>> my
>>> clients to keep Vista or XP since emailing about the only thing my 
>>> clients
>>> use their PC's for.    Please rethink this elimination of 
>>> Outlook/Outlook
>>> Express.  Ginny Lane
>>
>>
> 

0
stumblingblock
12/16/2009 1:40:30 AM
Its a thousand times better than Walmail.  More features and was written by 
people who knew how to program.  Sure it has flaws, but its 1000 X better 
than the crap MS is forcing down peoples' throats now.  We wanted them to 
fix OE.  Instead they wrote another crappy program.


"David B." <mail@nomail.net> wrote in message 
news:OdqvkoafKHA.2184@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
> What a ridiculous solution, Outlook Express itself has so many flaws who 
> would want to implement your solution just to run it?
>
> -- 
>
>
> --
> "Steve Cochran" <scochran@oehelp.com> wrote in message 
> news:523C1F7F-93F2-4C25-A84F-15BF5E4514A1@microsoft.com...
>> Many MVPs worked with Microsoft to improve Outlook Express over the 
>> years. During the development of Vista, OE had a name change to Windows 
>> Mail and some very nice improvements to the message store were being 
>> implemented. In the middle of that, Microsoft decided to abandon OE / 
>> WinMail and its users and to stop listening to the MVPs and the users, 
>> and instead came up with a oafish, stupid, and feature poor offspring it 
>> termed "Windows Live Mail", having inherited the same bugs and generated 
>> a new feature set of bugs for the users to download for use with Windows 
>> 7.  This crapware is now being forced down users' throats, and as you can 
>> see from the responses, users are being blamed for complaining about the 
>> crapware and not the authors.  In other words, since Microsoft came up 
>> with it and you don't like it, then that makes you stupid.
>>
>> Well, screw those people.  You can download Microsoft Virtual PC 2007 and 
>> install it on a Win7 machine.  Then you can install a version of XP as a 
>> Virtual Operating system and use that computer within a computer to 
>> continue to use the feature rich aspects of OE within the Windows 7 
>> environment. That way you can continue in the same manner to support your 
>> clients, and those who love Microsoft's moronic mail can keep using their 
>> crapware and maintain their bliss.
>>
>> steve
>>
>> "Ginny Lane" <Ginny Lane@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message 
>> news:102E5752-5E13-4821-9262-A9DA582EFF36@microsoft.com...
>>>I recently loaded Windows 7.  Basically I like it.  However, the email
>>> program sucks.   I read in a blog that "Windows Live Mail" was 
>>> implemented
>>> with the advertising because "the servers most go to had advertising 
>>> also".
>>> I disagree!!!! The servers may have advertising but Outlook/outlook 
>>> Express
>>> did not, thus the reason I used OE.  I have a computer training service 
>>> and I
>>> have always installed Outlook Express on my clients machines when 
>>> setting up
>>> their email, due to the fact they didn't want the ads all over the 
>>> screen.
>>> NOW THIS IS NOT EVEN A OPTION.   It is a HUGE mistake for microsoft to
>>> eliminate Outlook/Outlook Express.  Obviously no common ordinary PC 
>>> users
>>> were consulted when designing the email portion of Windows 7.  I'm truly
>>> disappointed and will probably switch to MAC's also I will  suggest to 
>>> my
>>> clients to keep Vista or XP since emailing about the only thing my 
>>> clients
>>> use their PC's for.    Please rethink this elimination of 
>>> Outlook/Outlook
>>> Express.  Ginny Lane
>>
>>
> 


0
Steve
12/16/2009 2:18:20 PM
Yeah, if you say so, I always love what happens when a dbx file hits 2GB, 
what a great feature, to bad Windows Mail doesn't have that one.

-- 


--
"Steve Cochran" <scochran@oehelp.com> wrote in message 
news:OKPthqlfKHA.1648@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
> Its a thousand times better than Walmail.  More features and was written 
> by people who knew how to program.  Sure it has flaws, but its 1000 X 
> better than the crap MS is forcing down peoples' throats now.  We wanted 
> them to fix OE.  Instead they wrote another crappy program.
>
>
> "David B." <mail@nomail.net> wrote in message 
> news:OdqvkoafKHA.2184@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>> What a ridiculous solution, Outlook Express itself has so many flaws who 
>> would want to implement your solution just to run it?
>>
>> -- 
>>
>>
>> --
>> "Steve Cochran" <scochran@oehelp.com> wrote in message 
>> news:523C1F7F-93F2-4C25-A84F-15BF5E4514A1@microsoft.com...
>>> Many MVPs worked with Microsoft to improve Outlook Express over the 
>>> years. During the development of Vista, OE had a name change to Windows 
>>> Mail and some very nice improvements to the message store were being 
>>> implemented. In the middle of that, Microsoft decided to abandon OE / 
>>> WinMail and its users and to stop listening to the MVPs and the users, 
>>> and instead came up with a oafish, stupid, and feature poor offspring it 
>>> termed "Windows Live Mail", having inherited the same bugs and generated 
>>> a new feature set of bugs for the users to download for use with Windows 
>>> 7.  This crapware is now being forced down users' throats, and as you 
>>> can see from the responses, users are being blamed for complaining about 
>>> the crapware and not the authors.  In other words, since Microsoft came 
>>> up with it and you don't like it, then that makes you stupid.
>>>
>>> Well, screw those people.  You can download Microsoft Virtual PC 2007 
>>> and install it on a Win7 machine.  Then you can install a version of XP 
>>> as a Virtual Operating system and use that computer within a computer to 
>>> continue to use the feature rich aspects of OE within the Windows 7 
>>> environment. That way you can continue in the same manner to support 
>>> your clients, and those who love Microsoft's moronic mail can keep using 
>>> their crapware and maintain their bliss.
>>>
>>> steve
>>>
>>> "Ginny Lane" <Ginny Lane@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message 
>>> news:102E5752-5E13-4821-9262-A9DA582EFF36@microsoft.com...
>>>>I recently loaded Windows 7.  Basically I like it.  However, the email
>>>> program sucks.   I read in a blog that "Windows Live Mail" was 
>>>> implemented
>>>> with the advertising because "the servers most go to had advertising 
>>>> also".
>>>> I disagree!!!! The servers may have advertising but Outlook/outlook 
>>>> Express
>>>> did not, thus the reason I used OE.  I have a computer training service 
>>>> and I
>>>> have always installed Outlook Express on my clients machines when 
>>>> setting up
>>>> their email, due to the fact they didn't want the ads all over the 
>>>> screen.
>>>> NOW THIS IS NOT EVEN A OPTION.   It is a HUGE mistake for microsoft to
>>>> eliminate Outlook/Outlook Express.  Obviously no common ordinary PC 
>>>> users
>>>> were consulted when designing the email portion of Windows 7.  I'm 
>>>> truly
>>>> disappointed and will probably switch to MAC's also I will  suggest to 
>>>> my
>>>> clients to keep Vista or XP since emailing about the only thing my 
>>>> clients
>>>> use their PC's for.    Please rethink this elimination of 
>>>> Outlook/Outlook
>>>> Express.  Ginny Lane
>>>
>>>
>>
>
> 

0
David
12/17/2009 2:15:29 PM
No one imagined 10 years ago that people would let their inboxes get to 2 
gigabytes.  That's a huge amount of messaging that wasn't anticipated back 
then.  We campaigned heavily for the switch away from the dbx files that 
they finally accomplished with Windows Mail, once they realized there really 
was the issue with the dbx files.  But then they went off and didn't finish 
Windows Mail in Vista and instead wrote a new mail program that incorporated 
the bugs that were already there in OE and WinMail and added some extra ones 
while at the same time removing features.

In Win7, one can also apply the same practice for WinMail and use Vista as a 
Virtual machine.  Either option is better than the alternative pursued by 
MS.

steve

"David B." <mail@nomail.net> wrote in message 
news:OKlqkNyfKHA.4528@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
> Yeah, if you say so, I always love what happens when a dbx file hits 2GB, 
> what a great feature, to bad Windows Mail doesn't have that one.
>
> -- 
>
>
> --
> "Steve Cochran" <scochran@oehelp.com> wrote in message 
> news:OKPthqlfKHA.1648@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
>> Its a thousand times better than Walmail.  More features and was written 
>> by people who knew how to program.  Sure it has flaws, but its 1000 X 
>> better than the crap MS is forcing down peoples' throats now.  We wanted 
>> them to fix OE.  Instead they wrote another crappy program.
>>
>>
>> "David B." <mail@nomail.net> wrote in message 
>> news:OdqvkoafKHA.2184@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>>> What a ridiculous solution, Outlook Express itself has so many flaws who 
>>> would want to implement your solution just to run it?
>>>
>>> -- 
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> "Steve Cochran" <scochran@oehelp.com> wrote in message 
>>> news:523C1F7F-93F2-4C25-A84F-15BF5E4514A1@microsoft.com...
>>>> Many MVPs worked with Microsoft to improve Outlook Express over the 
>>>> years. During the development of Vista, OE had a name change to Windows 
>>>> Mail and some very nice improvements to the message store were being 
>>>> implemented. In the middle of that, Microsoft decided to abandon OE / 
>>>> WinMail and its users and to stop listening to the MVPs and the users, 
>>>> and instead came up with a oafish, stupid, and feature poor offspring 
>>>> it termed "Windows Live Mail", having inherited the same bugs and 
>>>> generated a new feature set of bugs for the users to download for use 
>>>> with Windows 7.  This crapware is now being forced down users' throats, 
>>>> and as you can see from the responses, users are being blamed for 
>>>> complaining about the crapware and not the authors.  In other words, 
>>>> since Microsoft came up with it and you don't like it, then that makes 
>>>> you stupid.
>>>>
>>>> Well, screw those people.  You can download Microsoft Virtual PC 2007 
>>>> and install it on a Win7 machine.  Then you can install a version of XP 
>>>> as a Virtual Operating system and use that computer within a computer 
>>>> to continue to use the feature rich aspects of OE within the Windows 7 
>>>> environment. That way you can continue in the same manner to support 
>>>> your clients, and those who love Microsoft's moronic mail can keep 
>>>> using their crapware and maintain their bliss.
>>>>
>>>> steve
>>>>
>>>> "Ginny Lane" <Ginny Lane@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message 
>>>> news:102E5752-5E13-4821-9262-A9DA582EFF36@microsoft.com...
>>>>>I recently loaded Windows 7.  Basically I like it.  However, the email
>>>>> program sucks.   I read in a blog that "Windows Live Mail" was 
>>>>> implemented
>>>>> with the advertising because "the servers most go to had advertising 
>>>>> also".
>>>>> I disagree!!!! The servers may have advertising but Outlook/outlook 
>>>>> Express
>>>>> did not, thus the reason I used OE.  I have a computer training 
>>>>> service and I
>>>>> have always installed Outlook Express on my clients machines when 
>>>>> setting up
>>>>> their email, due to the fact they didn't want the ads all over the 
>>>>> screen.
>>>>> NOW THIS IS NOT EVEN A OPTION.   It is a HUGE mistake for microsoft to
>>>>> eliminate Outlook/Outlook Express.  Obviously no common ordinary PC 
>>>>> users
>>>>> were consulted when designing the email portion of Windows 7.  I'm 
>>>>> truly
>>>>> disappointed and will probably switch to MAC's also I will  suggest to 
>>>>> my
>>>>> clients to keep Vista or XP since emailing about the only thing my 
>>>>> clients
>>>>> use their PC's for.    Please rethink this elimination of 
>>>>> Outlook/Outlook
>>>>> Express.  Ginny Lane
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
> 


0
Steve
12/20/2009 2:22:40 PM
Reply:

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