If I copy text from Textedit or a pdf (using Preview) and then paste
that text into Word it'll crash.  Once that happens I have to log out
of OSX and come back before Word will run without crashing (it'll open
and as soon as I enter a keystroke or select a menu it crashes).  Copy
and pasting from within word is fine.  Running the latest version of
Office 2008.  Any thoughts?

What version/update of OS X? Have you recently repaired disk permissions?

The behavior you describe suggests that it may well not be a fault of Word,
but that perhaps something is being put on the clipboard which Word cannot
resolve. Is there anything other than plain text in what you're copying?
Links? Web content? What do you see if you switch to Finder after copying &
select Edit> Show Clipboard?  Have you tried using Edit> Paste Special -
Unformatted Text? What additional details can you provide.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones 
[MVP] Office:Mac



On 3/15/10 11:47 PM, in article
00507c09-5d88-4548-91ff-d2f37ecf0658@u19g2000prh.googlegroups.com, "Hadron"
<hadronflux@gmail.com> wrote:

> If I copy text from Textedit or a pdf (using Preview) and then paste
> that text into Word it'll crash.  Once that happens I have to log out
> of OSX and come back before Word will run without crashing (it'll open
> and as soon as I enter a keystroke or select a menu it crashes).  Copy
> and pasting from within word is fine.  Running the latest version of
> Office 2008.  Any thoughts?

I am also vexed by this problem and have basically switched over to Open 
Office, which does not have this problem.  I have the latest versions of OS X 
10.6.2 and Office Word 12.2.4.  The problem occurs copying and pasting from 
any Apple application (textedit, pages, and safari in particular).  I have 
deleted duplicates fonts, reinstalled office, deleted the normal template, 
removed input managers, turned off track changes, and the problem persists.


Note that this problem occurs on new documents so is not a corrupt document 
issue.  I am going to try the combo updater next.  That seems to be the last 
possible answer.

I can't paste unformatted because Word freezes as soon as I click on the edit 
menu.  Holding down shift when starting Word has no effect.  

Hi John;

Among the attempted fixes you've listed I see no reference to repairing disk
permissions. I'd suggest you first do that & see if anything changes.

If that doesn't help, try logging in as the same user while holding the
Shift key. Does the problem persist?

Have you tried using Word in a different (preferably new) User Account? Does
the same thing happen?

Please reply to this thread since it deals specifically with your issue. No
offense, but scattering/replicating your comments is a variety of other
threads can make things very confusing & otherwise problematic for those
trying to help as well as for those trying to follow the conversation � not
to mention making it more complicated for you to track any responses.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones 
[MVP] Office:Mac


On 3/17/10 1:18 PM, in article
98932B4A-75C8-4D26-8B68-13BDEFB00A9C@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan" <John
Heffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

> I am also vexed by this problem and have basically switched over to Open
> Office, which does not have this problem.  I have the latest versions of OS X
> 10.6.2 and Office Word 12.2.4.  The problem occurs copying and pasting from
> any Apple application (textedit, pages, and safari in particular).  I have
> deleted duplicates fonts, reinstalled office, deleted the normal template,
> removed input managers, turned off track changes, and the problem persists.
> 
> 
> Note that this problem occurs on new documents so is not a corrupt document
> issue.  I am going to try the combo updater next.  That seems to be the last
> possible answer.

Hi Bob,

I applied the combo updater, repaired permissions, and created a new 
account.  The problem persists.  

Here's part of a crash dump (it is too long to put here) if that helps. I am 
seeing some threads from a Prometheus Smartboard software, which I don't even 
use on this machine.  I will see if I can uninstall it.  

John




Date/Time:       2010-03-17 22:12:08 -0400
OS Version:      10.6.2 (Build 10C540)
Architecture:    x86_64
Report Version:  6

Command:         Word
Path:            /Applications/Microsoft Office 2008/Microsoft 
Word.app/Contents/MacOS/Microsoft Word
Version:         12.2.4 (12.2.4)
Build Version:   0
Project Name:    (null)
Source Version:  100205
Parent:          launchd [101]

PID:             142
Event:           hang
Duration:        6.44s (sampling started after 2 seconds)
Steps:           44 (100ms sampling interval)

Pageins:         34
Pageouts:        0


Process:         Microsoft Word [142]
Path:            /Applications/Microsoft Office 2008/Microsoft 
Word.app/Contents/MacOS/Microsoft Word
UID:             501


Process:         ACTIVdevice [157]
Path:            
/System/Library/Extensions/IOACTIV.kext/Contents/PlugIns/ACTIVdevice.app/Contents/MacOS/ACTIVdevice
UID:             501

  Thread 96fe000    DispatchQueue 100
  User stack:
    44 start + 41 (in ACTIVdevice) [0x2259]
      44 _start + 216 (in ACTIVdevice) [0x2332]
        44 main + 40 (in ACTIVdevice) [0x2fe0]
          44 RunProgram() + 30 (in ACTIVdevice) [0x3dd0]
            44 RunApplicationEventLoop + 228 (in HIToolbox) [0x95c2f944]
              44 _AcquireNextEvent + 54 (in HIToolbox) [0x95c39c02]
                44 ReceiveNextEventCommon + 354 (in HIToolbox) [0x95ab1cc3]
                  44 RunCurrentEventLoopInMode + 392 (in HIToolbox) 
[0x95ab1f0c]
                    44 CFRunLoopRunInMode + 97 (in CoreFoundation) 
[0x90d97691]
                      44 CFRunLoopRunSpecific + 452 (in CoreFoundation) 
[0x90d97864]
                        44 __CFRunLoopRun + 2079 (in CoreFoundation) 
[0x90d9877f]
                          44 mach_msg_trap + 10 (in libSystem.B.dylib) 
[0x9003b8da]
  Kernel stack:
    44 ipc_mqueue_receive_continue + 0 [0x210aa3]

  Thread 81f7b7c    DispatchQueue 1634545000
  User stack:
    44 start_wqthread + 30 (in libSystem.B.dylib) [0x90061336]
      44 _pthread_wqthread + 390 (in libSystem.B.dylib) [0x900614f1]
        44 _dispatch_worker_thread2 + 234 (in libSystem.B.dylib) [0x90061a68]
          44 _dispatch_queue_invoke + 163 (in libSystem.B.dylib) [0x90061cc3]
            44 kevent + 10 (in libSystem.B.dylib) [0x900620ea]
  Kernel stack:
    44 kevent + 97 [0x471745]

  Binary Images:
      0x1000 -    0x16fff  com.prometheanworld.activdevice 5.1 (5.1 Build 
23) <00010203-0405-0607-0809-0A0B0C0D0E0F> 
/System/Library/Extensions/IOACTIV.kext/Contents/PlugIns/ACTIVdevice.app/Contents/MacOS/ACTIVdevice
  0x9003b000 - 0x901dffeb  libSystem.B.dylib ??? (???) 
<D45B91B2-2B4C-AAC0-8096-1FC48B7E9672> /usr/lib/libSystem.B.dylib
  0x90d5c000 - 0x90ed3fef  com.apple.CoreFoundation 6.6.1 (550.13) 
<AE9FC6F7-F0B2-DE58-759E-7DB89C021A46> 
/System/Library/Frameworks/CoreFoundation.framework/Versions/A/CoreFoundation
  0x95a7d000 - 0x95da0fef  com.apple.HIToolbox 1.6.2 (???) 
<E02640B9-7BC3-A4B4-6202-9E4127DDFDD6> 
/System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/HIToolbox.framework/Versions/A/HIToolbox


Process:         ACTIVhardware [159]
Path:            
/System/Library/Extensions/IOACTIV.kext/Contents/PlugIns/ACTIVhardware.app/Contents/MacOS/ACTIVhardware
UID:             501

OK.  I uninstalled the Promethean Board SW and the problem still occurs.  It 
just happened to have threads running on the system during the Word hang I 
guess.  

However, if I boot in Safe Mode (holding down shift when restarting) I can 
copy and paste successfully (in this case, from Safari.)

Off to bed after spending about 6 hours + on this problem.  

Could the crash dump help pinpoint what is causing the hang?

Please don't say it is not our problem!  

John  

It certainly LOOKS like it is hanging waiting for a response from the
Promethean...

Difficult to tell from that Dump...

Cheers


On 18/03/10 1:44 PM, in article
1314FD6A-B3E0-43B9-B19F-1C23C34EE7F7@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
<JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

> OK.  I uninstalled the Promethean Board SW and the problem still occurs.  It
> just happened to have threads running on the system during the Word hang I
> guess.  
> 
> However, if I boot in Safe Mode (holding down shift when restarting) I can
> copy and paste successfully (in this case, from Safari.)
> 
> Off to bed after spending about 6 hours + on this problem.
> 
> Could the crash dump help pinpoint what is causing the hang?
> 
> Please don't say it is not our problem!
> 
> John  

 --

The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name

Hi John,

In the newer crash dumps (which I did not post), there are no Promethean 
threads showing since I uninstalled the software.  The problem still occurs.  
However, copy and paste from another application DOES work when I boot in 
safe mode. 

Please advise.  


John 

Here's a crash dump.  

http://www.jheffernan.com/WordHang.pdf

John  

After the hang, I am seeing some errors in the console like this...

3/18/10 7:05:10 AM	pkgutil[432]	PackageKit: *** Missing bundle identifier: 
/Library/Receipts/Office2008_en_word.pkg

I have the same problem on a macbook pro.  Word 2008 have a spinning ball when I copy something from different application.  I don't need to paste anything in word, only to put the focus in the application.  I tryed to repair permission, delete all preference file, and any file that are link to microsoft.  Reinstall office 2008 and the problem is still there.  The os is 10.6.2, office is up to date.  The problem is the same in root too.  On another compute with the same config/version I don't have this problem, so I copied the fonts to the computer with the problem, without success.  I removed anything that I saw on boot, but it look the word take a look to the clipboard when the focus is on it, and have difficulty to interpret the clipboard.  The os and application are in french.  Do you have any idea? <br><br>Thanks for the help!

I notice that Airport Utility is also in the frame there.  As a test, if you
connect to the router with an Ethernet cable, does the problem still happen?

There was a very old issue with the Airport Base Station that required a
firmware update to cure.  I doubt if your box is that old, but let's do the
test.  If that fixes it, you don't need to do the following :-)

The other issue would need us to do a full remove/replace.  Please follow
this process EXACTLY ...

1)  Quit ALL office applications, including the Entourage Daemon if it's
running.  Disconnect (unmount) any disks other than the boot partition.

2)  From Disk Utility, run "Repair Permissions" (we need to ensure we have
read/write permissions to the modules...)

3)  From the Office CD, run the Office Remover tool.

4)  Track down all instances of pre-2008 Normal template on your computer,
and drag them to your desktop.  The file is called simply "Normal" and has
no extension.

5)  Find and drag the file Normal.dotm to your desktop.  Unless you have
moved it, it should be in
/Users/~/Library/Application Support/Microsoft/Office/User Templates/

6)  If the following files exist, Remove or rename them:

 ~/Library/Preferences/Microsoft/Word Settings (10)

 ~/Library/Preferences/Microsoft/Word Settings (11)

7) User/Library/Preferences/com.Microsoft.Word.plist

8) User/Library/Preferences/Microsoft/Office 2008 (the whole folder!)

(After running "remove", some or all of those files will not exist...)

Now:  REBOOT!  We want to ensure we clear the memory.

Now put it back:

9)  Do a full install of Office 2008 from the Office CD.

10) Download the Office updates 12.1.0, 12.2.0, and 12.2.3 and 12.2.4.
Download them from the website http://www.microsoft.com/mac/downloads.mspx �
don't trust AutoUpdate for this.

11) Now (this is essential) Start FontBook and choose Edit>Resolve
Duplicated fonts.  Microsoft Office installs some fonts that are duplicates
of fonts installed by OS 10.6.2.  In each case, the version to keep is the
latest one.

11a) If you have a cache cleaning tool such as OnyX, now is the time to
clean the caches.

12)  Now shut down the system until the power goes off, then re-start.  This
triggers the Unix clean-up tasks that, among other things will rebuild the
font caches.

After all of that, if it doesn't work, we need to grade and pave the whole
system, which is easier than it sounds, but not something you look forward
to spending an hour on :-)

Cheers

On 18/03/10 10:19 PM, in article
A69794EB-057C-4DEC-B392-CC26E10FC994@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
<JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

> After the hang, I am seeing some errors in the console like this...
> 
> 3/18/10 7:05:10 AM pkgutil[432] PackageKit: *** Missing bundle identifier:
> /Library/Receipts/Office2008_en_word.pkg
> 
> 

 --

The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name

Hi Nicolas:

Let's see a crash dump from you also...

The French version has some idiosyncrasies that do not apply to the English
version.  We need to wait for Corentin or Bernard to come by: they run the
French version.

Cheers


On 19/03/10 1:59 AM, in article 59bb5503.10@webcrossing.JaKIaxP2ac0,
"Nicolas_Daigneault@officeformac.com" <Nicolas_Daigneault@officeformac.com>
wrote:

> I have the same problem on a macbook pro.  Word 2008 have a spinning ball when
> I copy something from different application.  I don't need to paste anything
> in word, only to put the focus in the application.  I tryed to repair
> permission, delete all preference file, and any file that are link to
> microsoft.  Reinstall office 2008 and the problem is still there.  The os is
> 10.6.2, office is up to date.  The problem is the same in root too.  On
> another compute with the same config/version I don't have this problem, so I
> copied the fonts to the computer with the problem, without success.  I removed
> anything that I saw on boot, but it look the word take a look to the clipboard
> when the focus is on it, and have difficulty to interpret the clipboard.  The
> os and application are in french.  Do you have any idea?
> 
> Thanks for the help!

 --

The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name

Will try it when I have a few hours.  Thanks for the help.

Just an FYI.  This problem started when I installed Snow Leopard.  

Hi John:

Which makes me very suspicious of "Fonts".  Snow Leopard creates an issue
with Fonts and Font Caches in Microsoft Word 2008.

But the indications you have are slightly different to what we normally
expect.

Snow Leopard also changed some low-level networking bits, which can lead to
some entertainment getting various network connections to work, particularly
over an airport, and particularly if you are using AppleTalk networking.

Cheers


On 19/03/10 12:04 PM, in article
3A1FEF10-AE39-4578-A1E5-4C938A3B95CB@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
<JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

> Will try it when I have a few hours.  Thanks for the help.
> 
> Just an FYI.  This problem started when I installed Snow Leopard.

 --

The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name

OK.  I reinstalled Office and the problem persists specifically with Safari.  

There were a couple of things I could not follow exactly.

I ran remove office from the HD and not the CD as indicated (could not find 
it on the CD).

Remove User/Library/...  I assume this was supposed to be ~ as the 2 above it.

When you said to keep the latest font using Resolve Duplicates, when I 
clicked Resolve Dupes, Font Book made the decision on which font to keep.

John

Also, I tried using the Ethernet connection and not airport and still had the 
problem.  Note, however, that shutting off Aiport and restarting does not 
stop the Airport thread seen in the crash dump.  

Yeah, it was.

And I just let FontBook do the thing too, it seems to get it right :-)

Cheers


On 20/03/10 1:06 AM, in article
5EF39E53-5159-4ED7-B78A-1A74A16C2BDC@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
<JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

> OK.  I reinstalled Office and the problem persists specifically with Safari.
> 
> There were a couple of things I could not follow exactly.
> 
> I ran remove office from the HD and not the CD as indicated (could not find
> it on the CD).
> 
> Remove User/Library/...  I assume this was supposed to be ~ as the 2 above it.
> 
> When you said to keep the latest font using Resolve Duplicates, when I
> clicked Resolve Dupes, Font Book made the decision on which font to keep.
> 
> John
> 
> 

 --

The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name

Hi John:

Ok, I need to know specifically WHAT you are pasting from Safari.

And I would like to see the Crash Dump that it offers to "Send to Apple".  I
want to know if anything has changed...

Sometimes, you can impute the cause from the symptoms, other times you need
to see the full diagnostics.

I just pasted from Safari here, and it's fine.

Cheers


On 20/03/10 1:07 AM, in article
04C30B8A-78FD-4AB7-BF76-B306D806549E@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
<JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

> Also, I tried using the Ethernet connection and not airport and still had the
> problem.  Note, however, that shutting off Aiport and restarting does not
> stop the Airport thread seen in the crash dump.

 --

The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name

I know I posted the original message and then haven't responded - been
busy.  I also have Promethian Activeboard software on my Mac, but
removing it isn't an option as I need it to teach. Here is a crash log
that I get from force-quitting after copying text from a pdf file
(note I didn't not even have to attempt to paste the text in word,
after copying any keystrokes in word crash it):
http://www.binarydiversion.com/temp/word_crash.rtf

I am not good enough at reading crash dumps to say definitively what is
causing this.

Your dump looks very similar to the other two, and you all have ACTIVBoards
installed.

I have asked the MS guys to dig the crash reports out of the database and
see if they can advise what the cause is (yes, your "Send to Apple" or "Send
to Microsoft" reports really do go "somewhere", and they really can dig them
out of the database and analyse them...)

Given that the guys are flat out trying to get Office 2011 on the shop
shelves right now, it may be a few weeks before we get an answer.

Cheers


On 22/03/10 3:28 AM, in article
ff5184f9-7d7a-4a62-86db-a9c69aac113f@g28g2000prb.googlegroups.com, "Hadron"
<hadronflux@gmail.com> wrote:

> I know I posted the original message and then haven't responded - been
> busy.  I also have Promethian Activeboard software on my Mac, but
> removing it isn't an option as I need it to teach. Here is a crash log
> that I get from force-quitting after copying text from a pdf file
> (note I didn't not even have to attempt to paste the text in word,
> after copying any keystrokes in word crash it):
> http://www.binarydiversion.com/temp/word_crash.rtf

 --

The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name

What's next, John?  

I got a query back from the engineers asking if this was affecting "All
Microsoft Office applications, or only Word."

I answered that to the best of our knowledge, this specific issue affects
only Word.

They haven't said any more yet.  Reading between the tea-leaves, I suggest
this means they have gone out to buy an ACTIVBoard card :-)

Cheers


On 23/03/10 10:45 PM, in article
84F5F985-B114-45AF-AF0F-F8A0B8667B88@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
<JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

> What's next, John?

 --

The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name

I missed the "More..." at the bottom of the screen for a couple of days and 
did not realize there were new replies here...


Will respond soon.  

John,

I removed the Prometheus Activboard software and still had the problem so I 
don't think that's it.  

John  

Hi John,

I just reproduced the problem again.  The text I used this time (not that it 
seems to matter) is from http://www.burgyschools.org/  and show below.

We wish to guide our children toward a lifelong love of learning for its own 
sake; toward an appreciation of the limitless power of knowledge; toward a 
vision of the future founded on lessons of the past; toward reverence for 
health of mind and body; toward dedication to principles of truth, friendship 
and justice in human affairs; and toward a desire to enjoy, to enhance and to 
preserve the beauty of the world in which their children will one day live.

I just send in the crash dump via Apple.  Do you want me to post it as a PDF 
or will you be able to find it.  By the way, I have sent quite a collection 
of them to MS so I am glad that they make it to someone. ;-)

John



"John McGhie" wrote:

> Hi John:
> 
> Ok, I need to know specifically WHAT you are pasting from Safari.
> 
> And I would like to see the Crash Dump that it offers to "Send to Apple".  I
> want to know if anything has changed...
> 
> Sometimes, you can impute the cause from the symptoms, other times you need
> to see the full diagnostics.
> 
> I just pasted from Safari here, and it's fine.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> 
> On 20/03/10 1:07 AM, in article
> 04C30B8A-78FD-4AB7-BF76-B306D806549E@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
> <JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
> 
> > Also, I tried using the Ethernet connection and not airport and still had the
> > problem.  Note, however, that shutting off Aiport and restarting does not
> > stop the Airport thread seen in the crash dump.
> 
>  --
> 
> The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
> matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!
> 
> John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
> McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
> Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name
> 
> 
> .
> 

More info...

EXCEL seems to have the same issue.

Cutting and pasting from Firefox, using the same text, does work.  Cutting 
and pasting to OpenOffice does work.  Cutting and pasting from other Apple 
applications exhibits the same issue.  So it seems to be an Apple/Microsoft 
issue ;-) 

John

Hi John:

If you send them in, they'll get them :-)  The crash dumps are injected into
a database keyed on memory offset, so any developer working on the bug will
see them ALL.  The more you send, the more accurately it will point at the
source of the problem.

I just needed the first one so I could tell 'em where to look in the
database.

Users who elect to "Don't send" are actually preventing Microsoft from
working on the bug, and should not be surprised if it doesn't get fixed :-)

Cheers


On 25/03/10 3:59 AM, in article
E7FFD6D1-BA2F-4686-A442-2F4D37A83A7F@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
<JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

> Hi John,
> 
> I just reproduced the problem again.  The text I used this time (not that it
> seems to matter) is from http://www.burgyschools.org/  and show below.
> 
> We wish to guide our children toward a lifelong love of learning for its own
> sake; toward an appreciation of the limitless power of knowledge; toward a
> vision of the future founded on lessons of the past; toward reverence for
> health of mind and body; toward dedication to principles of truth, friendship
> and justice in human affairs; and toward a desire to enjoy, to enhance and to
> preserve the beauty of the world in which their children will one day live.
> 
> I just send in the crash dump via Apple.  Do you want me to post it as a PDF
> or will you be able to find it.  By the way, I have sent quite a collection
> of them to MS so I am glad that they make it to someone. ;-)
> 
> John
> 
> 
> 
> "John McGhie" wrote:
> 
>> Hi John:
>> 
>> Ok, I need to know specifically WHAT you are pasting from Safari.
>> 
>> And I would like to see the Crash Dump that it offers to "Send to Apple".  I
>> want to know if anything has changed...
>> 
>> Sometimes, you can impute the cause from the symptoms, other times you need
>> to see the full diagnostics.
>> 
>> I just pasted from Safari here, and it's fine.
>> 
>> Cheers
>> 
>> 
>> On 20/03/10 1:07 AM, in article
>> 04C30B8A-78FD-4AB7-BF76-B306D806549E@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
>> <JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> Also, I tried using the Ethernet connection and not airport and still had
>>> the
>>> problem.  Note, however, that shutting off Aiport and restarting does not
>>> stop the Airport thread seen in the crash dump.
>> 
>>  --
>> 
>> The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
>> matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!
>> 
>> John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
>> McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
>> Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name
>> 
>> 
>> .
>> 

 --

The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name

Hi John:

Please re-write this information to make it very specific, so I can send it
to the developers.

By "does work.." do you mean it doesn't crash, or it does?

By "other Apple applications" -- Which ones, please?

Cheers


On 25/03/10 4:10 AM, in article
3EC8409F-0EBB-43A3-AE30-408115B6E960@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
<JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

> More info...
> 
> EXCEL seems to have the same issue.
> 
> Cutting and pasting from Firefox, using the same text, does work.  Cutting
> and pasting to OpenOffice does work.  Cutting and pasting from other Apple
> applications exhibits the same issue.  So it seems to be an Apple/Microsoft
> issue ;-) 
> 
> John
> 
> 

 --

The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name

   	More info...

EXCEL seems to have the same issue.  That is, EXCEL hangs with the spinning 
rainbow ball as soon as you put focus on the Edit Menu (or hit Apple V).  

Cutting and pasting from Firefox, using the same text, does work. The text 
is pasted successfully from FireFox (same website) into a new, blank Word 
Document.  

Cutting and pasting to OpenOffice does work. The text is pasted 
successfully.  

Cutting and pasting from other Apple applications exhibits the same issue. I 
have seen the same problem with Pages and Macintosh Mail specifically.  

So it seems to be an Apple/Microsoft issue ;-)

John
> By "other Apple applications" -- Which ones, please?
> 
> Cheers
> 
> 
> On 25/03/10 4:10 AM, in article
> 3EC8409F-0EBB-43A3-AE30-408115B6E960@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
> <JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
> 
> > More info...
> > 
> > EXCEL seems to have the same issue.
> > 
> > Cutting and pasting from Firefox, using the same text, does work.  Cutting
> > and pasting to OpenOffice does work.  Cutting and pasting from other Apple
> > applications exhibits the same issue.  So it seems to be an Apple/Microsoft
> > issue ;-) 
> > 
> > John
> > 
> > 
> 
>  --
> 
> The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
> matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!
> 
> John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
> McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
> Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name
> 
> 
> .
> 

Thanks John:

I've sent that in to the developers.

Cheers


On 26/03/10 2:30 AM, in article
59B720B4-DF19-4583-9851-CEBDE4F003C4@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
<JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

> More info...
> 
> EXCEL seems to have the same issue.  That is, EXCEL hangs with the spinning
> rainbow ball as soon as you put focus on the Edit Menu (or hit Apple V).
> 
> Cutting and pasting from Firefox, using the same text, does work. The text
> is pasted successfully from FireFox (same website) into a new, blank Word
> Document.  
> 
> Cutting and pasting to OpenOffice does work. The text is pasted
> successfully.  
> 
> Cutting and pasting from other Apple applications exhibits the same issue. I
> have seen the same problem with Pages and Macintosh Mail specifically.
> 
> So it seems to be an Apple/Microsoft issue ;-)
> 
> John
>> By "other Apple applications" -- Which ones, please?
>> 
>> Cheers
>> 
>> 
>> On 25/03/10 4:10 AM, in article
>> 3EC8409F-0EBB-43A3-AE30-408115B6E960@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
>> <JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> More info...
>>> 
>>> EXCEL seems to have the same issue.
>>> 
>>> Cutting and pasting from Firefox, using the same text, does work.  Cutting
>>> and pasting to OpenOffice does work.  Cutting and pasting from other Apple
>>> applications exhibits the same issue.  So it seems to be an Apple/Microsoft
>>> issue ;-) 
>>> 
>>> John
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>>  --
>> 
>> The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
>> matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!
>> 
>> John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
>> McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
>> Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name
>> 
>> 
>> .
>> 

 --

The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name

The Microsoft Developers have come back to us.

Their analysis of the dump John sent indicate "none of the call stacks
involve Word".  In other words: the system is not reading the memory
locations where Word is loaded in the lead-up to the hang.

This is, in fact, a step forward: of the three possible companies involved,
we now have one we can say for sure it isn't.  Given that Apple is the
other, and we must normally accept the operating system as a "given" when
making software to run on it, that leaves the compass pointing in only one
direction.

The Microsoft team suggest that, if you haven't done so already, you should
contact Promethean about this error.  They suggest that Promethean is bound
to have a copy of Microsoft Office on one of their computers with which they
can test all their cards and drivers, whereas Microsoft does not have
samples of all the Promethean cards :-)

In other words:  "Sorry, we can't fix that one, because it's not happening
in our code."

Hope this helps


On 26/03/10 12:49 PM, in article C7D25DE6.7FD0%john@mcghie.name, "John
McGhie" <john@mcghie.name> wrote:

> Thanks John:
> 
> I've sent that in to the developers.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> 
> On 26/03/10 2:30 AM, in article
> 59B720B4-DF19-4583-9851-CEBDE4F003C4@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
> <JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
> 
>> More info...
>> 
>> EXCEL seems to have the same issue.  That is, EXCEL hangs with the spinning
>> rainbow ball as soon as you put focus on the Edit Menu (or hit Apple V).
>> 
>> Cutting and pasting from Firefox, using the same text, does work. The text
>> is pasted successfully from FireFox (same website) into a new, blank Word
>> Document.  
>> 
>> Cutting and pasting to OpenOffice does work. The text is pasted
>> successfully.  
>> 
>> Cutting and pasting from other Apple applications exhibits the same issue. I
>> have seen the same problem with Pages and Macintosh Mail specifically.
>> 
>> So it seems to be an Apple/Microsoft issue ;-)
>> 
>> John
>>> By "other Apple applications" -- Which ones, please?
>>> 
>>> Cheers
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 25/03/10 4:10 AM, in article
>>> 3EC8409F-0EBB-43A3-AE30-408115B6E960@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
>>> <JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> More info...
>>>> 
>>>> EXCEL seems to have the same issue.
>>>> 
>>>> Cutting and pasting from Firefox, using the same text, does work.  Cutting
>>>> and pasting to OpenOffice does work.  Cutting and pasting from other Apple
>>>> applications exhibits the same issue.  So it seems to be an Apple/Microsoft
>>>> issue ;-) 
>>>> 
>>>> John
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>>>  --
>>> 
>>> The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
>>> matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!
>>> 
>>> John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
>>> McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
>>> Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name
>>> 
>>> 
>>> .
>>> 
> 
>  --
> 
> The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
> matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!
> 
> John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
> McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
> Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name
> 
> 

 --

The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name

I have repeated said that removing all the Promethean Board software does not 
alter the problem. 

Guess I will stick to have to stick to Open Office, which does not exhibit 
the same issue.  

And switch over our school district, too!  

Yeah, looks like it.

Whatever it is, it's not Word.

There is "something" on your system doing it.  I am not very good at reading
dumps, but looking at that one, it appears that the system calls the
handwriting software and never comes back...

Cheers


On 30/03/10 4:03 AM, in article
969897D4-FC13-4CBB-89DB-FAD723E698AC@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
<JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

> And switch over our school district, too!
> 
> 

 --

The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name

I am disappointed in the response from Microsoft on this.  Many people have 
reported this and the Microsoft products are the ones that are hanging while 
products that compete directly with Offce do not (OpenOffice).  So I think 
that good software engineers and good software engineering companies would 
want to get to the bottom of this problem, which directly or indirectly 
involves their product.  

Even though Microsoft is not pursuing this issue, I am still going to try and 
solve it.  One interesting thing is that Word is using 100% of the CPU when 
in this hung condition.  

Hi John:

I believe they have got to the bottom of it.  They know what the cause is,
and it's not in their code.  I believe that this is not a "choice" Microsoft
is making, there's nothing it *can* do about it: the hang is not happening
in their code.

And yes, Word will "show" 100% CPU when this is happening, but that's a bit
misleading: it's hanging in a wait-loop waiting for the system to come back
to it.  That will "show" 100% CPU, but the CPU is not actually 'doing'
anything, other than testing for the interrupt that would tell it that
whatever it asked for is now ready.

If it were actually DOING anything, you wouldn't be able to move the mouse
because there would be no CPU left to do that.

Cheers

On 31/03/10 10:47 AM, in article
1327FF9C-4D1F-4645-B09D-C02EB7FA3B7E@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
<JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

> I am disappointed in the response from Microsoft on this.  Many people have
> reported this and the Microsoft products are the ones that are hanging while
> products that compete directly with Offce do not (OpenOffice).  So I think
> that good software engineers and good software engineering companies would
> want to get to the bottom of this problem, which directly or indirectly
> involves their product.

 --

The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name

Hi John,

Can you elaborate on what the developers found out and whose code it is?

I got this response on the Apple boards (not from Apple) for what it is 
worth...

Thanks for your all your help, by the way.

John



If their software is freezing up, it's certainly nobody else's fault. If 
those Apple apps are for 
some reason creating bad clipboard data, Microsoft's apps should be able to 
gracefully recover and report the problem. Error handling is probably one of 
the most important, and most difficult, aspects of programming, but you can't 
blame poor error handling on anyone but the developer. I suspect that, rather 
than bad clipboard data, it's more likely to be a case of Microsoft's apps 
simply not understanding something about perfectly valid clipboard data, 
because they haven't properly followed Apple developer guidelines.

Hi John:

Welcome to "the blame game", otherwise known as "finger-pointing"  :-)

I agree with their comment that an application should be able to gracefully
recover.  But software does not live in a perfect world.  In this case, as
far as Word is concerned, it believes that it has nothing to recover "from".
It can't tell that it has hung, it simply knows that it's waiting.  It's the
operating system's job to tell it that what it is waiting for is not going
to ever occur.

Just what the Microsoft developers found I don't know, other than what they
told me which is "it's not in our code".  That's all they said.

Busy software developers working on the next version of a major product
don't stop around to chat.  And software developers are legendary for
"answering only the question that was asked, nothing more".

Either way:  All I know is that they said "It's not in our code".  Chances
are, they don't know whose code the problem actually occurs in.  They can
see from the dump where the program counter was pointing: so they know the
memory location in which the problem occurred.  They know that their
software has nothing in that location.  Chances are, they DON'T know what
software (if any..) does have something in that location.

I am sure they could find out.  But they would have to spend four hours
setting things up to get that information, and it would not do them any
good, because they know it's not in their code so they know they can't do
anything about it.

But I am speculating here.  We have "It's not in our code".  That's twice as
good as what we usually get on these things.  Usually, they simply say "We
will investigate" and I hear nothing more.

So:  I can't add anything further.

Cheers


On 31/03/10 9:39 PM, in article
30012FFA-0DF8-48B7-8426-B059684549E3@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
<JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

> Hi John,
> 
> Can you elaborate on what the developers found out and whose code it is?
> 
> I got this response on the Apple boards (not from Apple) for what it is
> worth...
> 
> Thanks for your all your help, by the way.
> 
> John
> 
> 
> 
> If their software is freezing up, it's certainly nobody else's fault. If
> those Apple apps are for
> some reason creating bad clipboard data, Microsoft's apps should be able to
> gracefully recover and report the problem. Error handling is probably one of
> the most important, and most difficult, aspects of programming, but you can't
> blame poor error handling on anyone but the developer. I suspect that, rather
> than bad clipboard data, it's more likely to be a case of Microsoft's apps
> simply not understanding something about perfectly valid clipboard data,
> because they haven't properly followed Apple developer guidelines.
> 
> 

 --

The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name

John,

I know you did everything you could, which I appreciate.  But the customers 
experiencing this issue still have no solution.  This is where, in my 
experience as a software engineer some years ago, the really good one will 
work with the other company, presumably Apple in this case, to solve the 
problem, which does not sound like it is going to happen.  So we are left 
with switching to Open Office or reinstalling OS X from scratch after backing 
up and then erasing the disk and reinstalling the OS and all applications in 
the hope that it might fix the problem.  Not very choices.

John

I did find a workaround for this problem.  

If you paste from Safari, Mail, Pages, TextEdit into the older AppleWorks 
program first, you can then paste into Word without a hang.  

It seems like there is some problem between the newer Apple programs and 
Office.  It does not seem to affect all computers, which I do not understand. 
 Hopefully, Apple and Microsoft will fix this problem in the future.  

John

Hi John:

Well, I have a fairly high degree of hope that this issue will be resolved
if you buy Office 2011.  Office 2011 is a major upgrade, apparently due at
the end of this year.

As a former software engineer, you know as well as I do that shrink-wrap
(retail) software is a low-margin industry that does not support a lot of
support or maintenance activity.

Sorry, but that's the reality.  If functionality is important, it's up to us
to test for it.  As you know, major companies very carefully qualify an
entire desktop environment so it supports what they need.

Cheers 


On 2/04/10 1:00 AM, in article
C536F2B1-B7F0-48EC-BAF8-0E2DB7489C30@microsoft.com, "John Heffernan"
<JohnHeffernan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

> I did find a workaround for this problem.
> 
> If you paste from Safari, Mail, Pages, TextEdit into the older AppleWorks
> program first, you can then paste into Word without a hang.
> 
> It seems like there is some problem between the newer Apple programs and
> Office.  It does not seem to affect all computers, which I do not understand.
>  Hopefully, Apple and Microsoft will fix this problem in the future.
> 
> John
> 
> 

 --

The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name

Unfortunately, I have the &quot;same&quot; freeze symptoms more-often-than-not when I begin typing into a virgin document on opening Word.  I have done all of the above and other recommendations from other MVPs (who have become the whipping boys &amp; gals on this rather than MBU) on other boards and I still get the error.  I do not have Promethium.  This ONLY happens with MS Word (and now it's starting to impact MS Excel).   <br><br>I'd love to try 2011 but as you say it won't be out till the end of the year (I'll hedge my bets and say middle of the next year).  I don't want to start a new learning curve with iWork, buy MathType, and also deal with the lack of 1:1 document computability between Pages and Word 2007/8 and frustrate my colleagues.  But the situation is leaving me little choice.   <br><br>While we really do very much appreciate what MVPs like you are trying to do to help slobs us in the LUSER community, we'd appreciate a solution from the source.  This problem has gone on long enough... and our productivity and confidence in MS products are suffering :-/

Hi Bill:

You do not have "the same" freeze problems.  You have a highly individual
set of problems that are causing your individual copy of Word to freeze.

Start your own thread and we'll help you fix it.

But we need to employ a specific, focussed solution customised for YOUR
computer. So make sure you give us plenty of technical details and version
numbers.

Cheers


On 10/04/10 5:55 AM, in article 59bb5503.43@webcrossing.JaKIaxP2ac0,
"Bill_Capehart@officeformac.com" <Bill_Capehart@officeformac.com> wrote:

> Unfortunately, I have the "same" freeze symptoms more-often-than-not when I
> begin typing into a virgin document on opening Word.  I have done all of the
> above and other recommendations from other MVPs (who have become the whipping
> boys & gals on this rather than MBU) on other boards and I still get the
> error.  I do not have Promethium.  This ONLY happens with MS Word (and now
> it's starting to impact MS Excel).
> 
> I'd love to try 2011 but as you say it won't be out till the end of the year
> (I'll hedge my bets and say middle of the next year).  I don't want to start a
> new learning curve with iWork, buy MathType, and also deal with the lack of
> 1:1 document computability between Pages and Word 2007/8 and frustrate my
> colleagues.  But the situation is leaving me little choice.
> 
> While we really do very much appreciate what MVPs like you are trying to do to
> help slobs us in the LUSER community, we'd appreciate a solution from the
> source.  This problem has gone on long enough... and our productivity and
> confidence in MS products are suffering :-/

 --

The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay!

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name

> Hi Bill: <br>
>  <br>
> You do not have &quot;the same&quot; freeze problems.  You have a highly individual <br>
> set of problems that are causing your individual copy of Word to freeze. <br>
>  <br>
> Start your own thread and we'll help you fix it. <br>
>  <br>
> But we need to employ a specific, focussed solution customised for YOUR <br>
> computer. So make sure you give us plenty of technical details and version <br>
> numbers. <br>
>  <br>
> Cheers <br>
>  <br>
>  <br>
> On 10/04/10 5:55 AM, in article 59bb5503.43@webcrossing.JaKIaxP2ac0, <br>
> &quot;Bill_Capehart@officeformac.com&quot;  wrote: <br>
>  <br>
> > Unfortunately, I have the &quot;same&quot; freeze symptoms more-often-than-not when I <br>
> > begin typing into a virgin document on opening Word.  I have done all of the <br>
> > above and other recommendations from other MVPs (who have become the whipping <br>
> > boys &amp; gals on this rather than MBU) on other boards and I still get the <br>
> > error.  I do not have Promethium.  This ONLY happens with MS Word (and now <br>
> > it's starting to impact MS Excel). <br>
> >  <br>
> > I'd love to try 2011 but as you say it won't be out till the end of the year <br>
> > (I'll hedge my bets and say middle of the next year).  I don't want to start a <br>
> > new learning curve with iWork, buy MathType, and also deal with the lack of <br>
> > 1:1 document computability between Pages and Word 2007/8 and frustrate my <br>
> > colleagues.  But the situation is leaving me little choice. <br>
> >  <br>
> > While we really do very much appreciate what MVPs like you are trying to do to <br>
> > help slobs us in the LUSER community, we'd appreciate a solution from the <br>
> > source.  This problem has gone on long enough... and our productivity and <br>
> > confidence in MS products are suffering :-/ <br>
>  <br>
>  -- <br>
>  <br>
> The email below is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum <br>
> matters unless I ask you to; or unless you intend to pay! <br>
>  <br>
> John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word), Consultant Technical Writer, <br>
> McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd <br>
> Sydney, Australia. | Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410 | mailto:john@mcghie.name <br><br>Hi John, <br><br>I placed a request for help on my problem back in Feb. <br><br>It's here: <br><br><a href="http://www.officeformac.com/ms/ProductForums/Word/9531/1">http://www.officeformac.com/ms/ProductForums/Word/9531/1</a> <br><br>Bill

No Probs, I'll take a look...

On 10/04/10 10:37 PM, in article 59bb5503.45@webcrossing.JaKIaxP2ac0,
"Bill_Capehart@officeformac.com" <Bill_Capehart@officeformac.com> wrote:

> Hi John, 
> 
> I placed a request for help on my problem back in Feb.
> 
> It's here: 
> 
> http://www.officeformac.com/ms/ProductForums/Word/9531/1
> 
> Bill

This email is my business email -- Please do not email me about forum
matters unless you intend to pay!

 -- 

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP (Word, Mac Word); Consultant Technical Writer,
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd, Sydney, Australia.
Ph: +61 (0)4 1209 1410; mailto:john@mcghie.name

> No Probs, I'll take a look... <br><br>Thanks and good luck! <br><br>That thread seems to be locked shut so I opened a new one <br><br><a href="http://www.officeformac.com/ms/ProductForums/Word/10146/0">http://www.officeformac.com/ms/ProductForums/Word/10146/0</a>